Fully expecting an Ahem, though I did do a search.

Yahoo has a trailor up...

http://movies.yahoo.com/feature/thedeparted.html

From the looks of things it's going to be quite faithful to the HK original. Not sure if I like Jack Nicholson in the role, but we'll see. This is a must see for me. Apparently October 6th is the date.

Link to the thread on Infernal Affairs.

I've never been a full-fledged Scorsese fan, but I do want to see this. The trailer has me very, very much intrigued.

I urge you all to go rent Infernal Affairs before you see this. ]

Sure, it'll spoil some twists... but I have my doubts that Scorsese's film is going to top the original, which is a prime example of a lean, mean cops-and-bad-guys thriller. And it's got Tony Leung! And Andy Lau!

Personally, I would have preferred to see Michael Mann direct this, if the film had to be re-made at all.

Oh, by the way, here's the poster:

During summer 05', this was being filmed all over Boston. I narrowly missed seeing the sets and actors a few times (I was in the same neighborhoods but not at the right times). Nicholson was on the cover of the Boston Herald almost every day.

So for the Boston scenery alone, I want to see this movie. Then again I watched Mystic River for the same reason and ended up disappointed.*

*-Sorry for that gratuitous swipe, Mark!

I watched Infernal Affairs this past weekend with a friend, and everytime I watch this, my appreciation of Leung and Lau (who I didn't actually care for too much before I saw this film) grows a bit more.

Would Leonardo DiCaprio have a career without Scorsese? I mean, that's just about all I see him doing!

edit:: I looked on imdb, and yeah, I'd forgotten about Catch Me If You Can, but three of his past four have been with Scorsese.

I buy DiCaprio in Catch Me If You Can. I bought him... somewhat... in The Aviator. I didn't buy him in Gangs of New York. From the looks of things, I don't think I'll buy him in this.

He still looks like a kid, even with facial hair. He still sounds like a kid. I just don't get why Scorsese's so set on him. I believe he has talent, but he's usually cast in the wrong kind of role, and thus what registers is sheer determination to convince us. And sheer determination reminds me of one actor in particular... Tom Cruise. And that's not a good thing.

I re-watched the trailer the other day and pretty much figured out the whole movie, based on my knowledge of the original. Most of the plot twists seem intact, although it looks like Scorsese is handling what ended up being my favorite moment in the film quite a bit differently. I can expand on that but it will be spoilertastic.

I haven't seen anything one way or the other yet to know what happened to Kelly Chen's character in the original.

I have to second the recommendation to see Infernal Affairs first, if only to catch one of the best gangster films to come out of Hong Kong since Woo. The second movie in the series is good too... I wonder if the screenwriter for The Departed incorporated any elements from the HK sequels as was done with The Ring.

Andrew Sarris is rejoicing... that's the word he uses... over The Departed. He's actually making me adjust my rather low expectations with this enthusiastic review.

And by the way, David, the buzz on DiCaprio's performance in this is high, but I've also heard that he's really good in Blood Diamond, which was done by Edward Zwick. And he's in an upcoming Steve Gaghan film called Blink. So we'll get to see what other directors can get out of him soon. I loved his performance in Catch Me If You Can, and his performance in What's Eating Gilbert Grape showed how good he can be... and how funny... so I look forward to seeing what he can do.

Here's hoping Ed Zwick is back to his form in Glory. His last big splash was that subpar Bruce Willis flick about Martial Law in NYC.

Actually, wasn't The Last Samurai a bigger hit than The Siege?

A quick peek at Box Office Mojo says that TLS made over $111 million, while The Siege made just over $40 million.

Well, I can't publish my own thoughts yet, but if you need any more information before you go see this thing:

Look here, and here, and read this:



And for the record, I'm withdrawing all of my complaints about having Infernal Affairs remade.

I see this morning that The Departed is no longer getting a 100% "fresh" rating at Rotten Tomatoes, thanks to J. Hoberman's "splat" in the Village Voice.

Interview with Scorsese in today's Guardian:

It's getting old, being out of step with the overwhelming majority of critics, but I can't get excited about this movie.

My younger brother saw this movie with me. He's not a big movie watcher, but the first words out of his mouth, as we left the theater, were, "I feel like I've seen that movie 40 or 50 times already."

Same here. And Scorcese made all 40 or 50 of 'em. It's interesting to see so many reviewers in full swoon for this flick, even as they acknowledge that it's a retread for the filmmaker. But he "back on his game," so everyone's happy.

Everyone but me.

I don’t feel quite so alone after checking Dave Kehr’s Web site, where I discovered that he, too, didn’t think too much of “The Departed,” which continues to rate an amazing 95% “fresh” over at Rotten Tomatoes.

I saw this tonight and I have to say I'm a little disappointed. Whereas Infernal Affairs picked up in the last third, The Departed started to fall apart. While Andrew Lau and co. made a haunting and effective film about the personal hell of living a lie, Scorsese just remade Reservoir Dogs.

The Departed is a plot point for plot point remake of Infernal Affairs, and had some excellent performances and dialog. The first two thirds of the movie were great, while the last third was messy and annoying. The writer managed to keep the plot the same but completely missed the spirit of the original movie. Completely missed. There was no trace of any of the substance the original had in this movie, but then again I didn't find much substance in the other Scorsese films I've seen either.

Perhaps I wouldn't be disappointed if I hadn't seen the original, but then again... I wouldn't have bothered to see this if not for Infernal Affairs. People in the theater were literally laughing at the ending... that can't be good for a film like this.

David Smedberg:



I'm guessing DiCaprio is Scorsese's new De Niro. He's also attatched to star as a young Teddy Roosevelt in Scorsese's The Rise of Theodore Roosevelt.

This is perfect casting (unless he was casting an unknown). The book is wonderful, and Roosevelt's early years are an amazing move from sickly weakling to President of the United States. I have high hopes, unless the film seeks to "deconstruct" Teddy.

(Sorry for the tangent).

Absolutely loved this and am intending to rewatch it again soon.

As for Leo - I always said that the only role he fitted was in This Boy's Life. I can now completely 100% retract that statement. The entire film is a casting joy. Even my initial apprehension with Mark Whalberg went out of the window and others delivered performances so left of field from their usual fare (Alec Baldwin) that I was taken completely by surprise.

It's by far Scorsese's most mature film, both stylistically and in regard to content. One or two minor plot points that could have been tidied up a bit but otherwise good cinema doesn't get much better than this.

Place me below Gigi and above Christian (probably above theoddone as well). It's good, but I don't quite get the big list of 100s on metacritic.

This may be my favorite work from DiCaprio since his Gilbert Grape and Basketball Diaries days. Wahlberg's character is the one that may be the most interesting to me, but he's almost expendable in the film [spoiler]other than for his role in setting things straight at the end.[/spoiler] Madolyn didn't quite work for me.

The basic plot of dual rats looking for each other played out well. It's all the stuff on the edges, that brought it down a bit for me.

Regarding DiCaprio, for what it's worth, I thought he did a fine job and his performance was a high point of the movie. I didn't like Wahlberg's character, his haircut, or his singular reason for existing in the film. [spoiler]Giving a bad guy who begs to be killed at one point in the movie exactly what he desires is kind of letting him off easy. Personally, I prefer IA's approach of letting him live with the scars of what he's done... but then again in IA the character turned on the mob boss because he wanted to sever his ties with evil, in a sense, and finally be the "good guy". In Departed, he just did it as a CYA measure. Kind of a lame change... that about sums up both reasons I didn't like this film's choices when compared with the original.[/spoiler]

Nicholson didn't really give me the "supervillian" feel... more ridiculous than anything else. Damon and Sheen just felt like scenery. I'm sure I'll like the movie more after I get over the fact that they ruined something wonderful and start judging it on its own merits.

Edit: I'm going to say more just to get it all out of my head:

[spoiler]The baby was a stupid and unnecessary plot point. It was obvious that it could have been Leo's, but was it? Does it matter? There was no point to the inclusion of the plot point at all, unless it was supposed to further the development of Madolyn's character... 10 minutes before the movie ends and she has no more dialogue.[/spoiler]

Interesting comparison factoid: In IA the events of the movie took place a good 10 years after the main characters first went undercover in their respective organizations. In The Departed the entire thing seems to happen in a span of months ([spoiler]"How long have you been with your boyfriend?" "About four months"[/spoiler]). Personally, I find The Departed's timeline for all of this a bit.... fantastic.

They should have been more clever translating the [spoiler]"citizens envelope"[/spoiler] plot point. It was a gag that worked much better in Chinese, and they were very very intentional about making sure everyone "got it", whereas the original movie trusted its audience a bit more.

Really? I definitely liked his performance, but found it to be almost the same basic character he's been playing in lots of films lately.


And of course these are two of the big changes in this film from IA. [spoiler]There is no Wahlberg character in IA (probably either for the reasons theoddone mentioned or because Wahlberg just wanted a role so they made one for him), and the Madolyn character is a combination of two characters from IA. Another change that I didn't particularly think worked very well.[/spoiler]

There were things I liked better than IA, and things I missed. The biggest thing I missed, which is directly related to the dual rats idea, [spoiler]was the big drug deal scene early in IA where they both tried to stay one step ahead of each other with the help of their rats. They *sort of* did this scene in TD (the chip sale to the Chinese) but it comes much later in the movie and there's much less back and forth "chess playing" going on with the rats. [/spoiler]This scene was brilliant in IA, and had the direct consequence of clueing in both sides to the fact that they had a mole in their organization. In TD, they both already know this, which takes something away from it. [spoiler]I also loved how that scene led into the showdown between cops and bad guys in the police station in IA, which was a really funny scene, whereas they had to just sort of replace that scene with a standalone meeting between Jack and Martin/Mark in TD.[/spoiler]

Saw it, not having seen IA, but loved it. No time to say more at the moment, but hopeully will do soon.

Matt

Yeah. I would say it's in my top ten right now.

It's a very good film, and I enjoyed it, but I can't say that I loved it. The plot is intriguing and the performances are excellent by DiCaprio, Damon, Nickolson, Baldwin, and Wahlberg. However, the ending left me a little cold, and I never could engage emotionally with the characters. I haven't seen Infernal Affairs, but reading this thread makes me want to now, to see if there is a sense of morality or emotion in that film that didn't quite translate here.

Wow - I loved this. I have not seen IA (well, I've seen the Richard Gere IA which was more like a TV movie and I assume has nothing to do with these films), and I haven't seen a Scorsese film in years. I don't tend to like big, long, epic films in general, but nothing else is playing here and some friends wanted to go.

IMO: The only misstep was Wahlberg's hair. And I could be argued into saying Nicholson is a bit of a caricature of himself. Other than that, no complaints. And, as others have said, I finally see Leo D.'s appeal. His work in this movie, I think, is truly outstanding. Actually, so is Matt Damon's.

My only question:
[spoiler]At the very end, after Damon is shot, we see the dome of the capital (capitol?) building. Is this to remind us that Damon aspired to politics and killing him was the only way to stop him from taking his corruption all the way to the top, or was it just to show the rat, or some bigger message that all political systems are corrupt and rat-infested? Opinions?[/spoiler]

My top 3 Scorsese movies are now Alice Doesn't Live Here Anymore, Taxi Driver, and The Departed.

Odd... I could have sworn that I posted on here about Scorsese's interview in November's Sight & Sound. Entitled "God, Violence, and The Departed" it focuses on Silence & Scorsese's vision of Catholicism. Unfortunately still not online but I'm sure it will be in the next few weeks.

Oh wait... did I post this in the Silence thread? Either way, it won't hurt for this to double up here.

Wow, I've got to read that interview. Thanks, gigi.

Sara:



No way. That was one of the film's best jokes. I laughed every time I looked at him. (Well, expect maybe that LAST time I saw him.)

And yes, Nicholson was a little too out of control.

Actually, I was a little dissapointed by the article but it's still worth checking out.

Am I the only person who didn't even notice Mark Whalberg's hair?

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I've been looking forward to this one for awhile. The old cliche "Wildly uneven" is what I keep thinking, having seen it. I'll definately be seeing it again. There were moments where I was thinking to myself "This is one of the best crime films I've ever seen." and others where I had no idea what Scorsese (or the editor?) was trying to get across. Was Thelma Schoonmaker (sp?) the only editor or did the studio bring someone else in? The scene with Nicholson and the cocaine party/ orgy seemed pointless. Around that same time Martin Sheen tells Decaprio "Let's go to the kitchen and talk." but we never see that happen even though their conversation was supposedly important. There seemed to be whole sections of these scenes missing. Also, I love Scorcese's use of music in film but here I was a little disappointed he reused "Gimmie Shelter". Things like that make it hard to argue he's not repeating himself. Overall I really enjoyed this one. My friend and I and most of the audeince laughed with most of the movie. Even having seen [/i]Infernal Affairs I was still shocked at who dies and when. It's no Goodfellas or Casio but crime films are why I love Scorsese.

QUOTE(Sara Zarr @ Oct 14 2006, 01:44 PM) [snapback]130302[/snapback]

Wow - I loved this. I have not seen IA (well, I've seen the Richard Gere IA which was more like a TV movie and I assume has nothing to do with these films),

The Richard Gere film was [i]Internal Affairs. The Departed is a remake of Infernal Affairs. And no, they have nothing to do with each other.

Should DiCaprio get a Best Actor nomination for The Departed? Jeffrey Wells says "No question."

Now Wells writes:

"At this point, according to his p.r. rep Ken Sunshine, DiCaprio will join his Departed brothers in the supporting actor category, which will pit him against Nicholson and Damon in a hugely competitive race."

WHAT? Studio politics baffle me. DiCaprio is clearly the lead actor in The Departed. It's no insult to Nicholson or Damon to put them in the Supporting category, while DiCaprio gets considered for Best Actor.

UPDATE: The more I think on it, the more I see Damon and DiCaprio as both giving leading performances, although DiCaprio probably gets more screen time.

I'm not a Leonardo DiCaprio fan at all, but he owns this film. I found myself more invested in his character's arc than those of either Nicholson or Damon. An Oscar nomination would be well deserved, though in general I don't think a movie as pulpy and hard edged as this one will gain much favor with the Academy.

I haven't seen Gangs of New York, but I imagine it must be very similar to this: tons of blood, violence, and Irish/Italian ethnic tensions.

Has anyone commented on the religious meaning in the titles, yet?

If memory serves, Infernal Affairs gets its title from a Buddhist scripture's reference to Hell.

Whereas The Departed includes a couple of references, at funerals, to "the faithful departed" -- except, of course, that the word "faithful" is conspicuously absent from the title.

FWIW, though, the phrase "the departed" sans faithful also appears in Catholic rituals, even the Mass, although I have no idea if it appears in the movie.

I'm not sure what the Chinese title of Infernal Affairs is, or what it means anymore... but if that's true then I find the juxtaposition of the two titles appropriate, since the former movie was actually about the Buddhist concept of Hell, and the latter movie was about people dying. It's the primary reason I think the former is a better film overall.

And yeah, I think DiCaprio deserves an Oscar... hands down, but I don't think anyone else's work on this movie really warrants one.

The Departed crossed the $100 million dollar mark over the weekend. The first Martin Scorcese film to pass that milestone.

Baal_T'shuvah wrote:
: The Departed crossed the $100 million dollar mark over the weekend. The first Martin Scorcese
: film to pass that milestone.

Nope, that would be The Aviator (2004). But yes, as of Tuesday (probably), The Departed is now Scorsese's top-grossing film ever.

It's also Leonardo DiCaprio's third-highest-grossing film, after Titanic (1997), obviously, and Catch Me If You Can (2002). And it will soon be Mark Wahlberg's third-highest, after Planet of the Apes (2001) and The Perfect Storm (2000).

Matt Damon has six films on his roster that have done better than this -- though he was just one among many stars in Saving Private Ryan (1998) and the Ocean's movies (2001-2004). Also ahead of The Departed, on his roster, are Good Will Hunting (1997) and the Bourne movies (2002-2004).

FWIW, it looks like the only Alec Baldwin films that will stay ahead of this one are Pearl Harbor (1998) and The Hunt for Red October (1990).

And as for Jack Nicholson ... heck, the guy's been around for ages, and if One Flew over the Cuckoo's Nest (1975) or Terms of Endearment (1983) made over $100 million in their day -- thus, I assume, putting each film easily among the top two or three earners of their respective years (the only 1983 film that did better than Terms of Endearment was Return of the Jedi) -- does it really compare to a film making $100 million in THIS day and age?

Andy Lau Not Impressed With Hollywood Adaptation of 'Infernal Affairs'
(Interestingly, one of his big complaints is the same as mine.)


Less of a problem with Damon than the script, though. And only a "problem" if you enjoy interesting characters more than good cop/bad cop cliches.

I had to write a review of this film for one of my classes today. As I wrote, it struck me that as good as The Departed is based on its cinematic merits, I'm unsure about what it's really trying to say.

Is Scorsese just trying to be cool, remaking Reservoir Dogs only with a grittier milieu, cooler production values, and a better plot?

Is [spoiler]Costigan's death supposed to signify the sacrificing of innocence for justice's sake?[/spoiler]

Is the film's tagline ("Cops and Criminals. When you're facing a loaded gun, what's the difference?") supposed to be a cue that the law is crooked and that we're all screwed?

I guess that the film is open to multiple readings, but I'm having trouble deciding how I choose to view it.

I received a letter from someone who thought that Sheen's character was deliberately pushed into the smallest role so that his starkly different story would be a glimmer of [spoiler]Christian virtue and sacrifice[/spoiler] in a world of darkness and corruption. And it is true that he's the one character [spoiler]specifically identified as having personal faith (he crosses himself when alone... right before he gives his life to save someone else).[/spoiler]

Personally, I just felt like he was pushed to the side because he was the least corrupt, and thus the least interesting. But I'm still thinking about this. His character makes quite an impression considering how rarely he participates in the action.

Mel Gibson says he was offered a part in this film.

No, you are not.

And as another person not having seen IA, I thought The Departed simply rocked.

-s.

This is interesting, and it is something I found myself thinking about during the film. I think DiCaprio excels in the film, and his psychological struggles are very apparent. Why not for Damon's character? I kept thinking that he might turn on Nicholson, or at least be tempted to [spoiler](and I mean before the very end).
[/spoiler]. It would have been effective to see him more interested in escaping his past to move on to a less corrupt/more secure (family) future. Was this there and I'm simply forgetting it already? Am I forgetting it because Damon didn't do it as effectively as DiCaprio?

Probable below.



This was a primary focus of IA, and I missed it a lot in The Departed. Lau's character changed when [spoiler]his actions caused the death of a fellow cop, something he didn't really intend.[/spoiler] Lau became sort of focused on atonement for his misdeeds at that point, and the conflicted nature of his role really came out. He pretty much wanted to forget that he had any ties with the mob, and thought he could make it all go away by [spoiler]killing the mob boss he'd been working for.[/spoiler] The way Lau brought out the conflicted nature of his character was really striking... in the original I thought he did a better job than Tony Leung, whose character went through the same sort of thing.

In The Departed, it was switched around a bit. As I said above, I blame the script. It's not really worse... it's just different, but to me it makes The Departed a less interesting film. You'll recall the discussion in the bar where DiCaprio and Nicholson talk about who the rat is. DiCaprio says [spoiler]it's the guy that thinks he can do Nicholson's job better than Nicholson.[/spoiler] Then the rest of the film was spent setting things up so that [spoiler]Damon was the guy who thought he could do things better than Nicholson, not the guy who was actually the rat.[/spoiler] The film made Damon's actions more about [spoiler]turning the tables on Nicholson, who had the power to turn him in as an "FBI informant" than they were about any sort of contrition for his misdeeds.[/spoiler] Damon's character was one-dimentional, rather than the conflicted sort of interesting character brought out by Lau.

I'm thinking DiCaprio deserves a best Actor nod for this. He really knocked it out of the park... moreso than Leung did in the first movie, I'd say. But for me at least, the change to Damon/Lau's character, among a short list of other things, really made this movie kind of a poor experience for me.

*There will be peppered throughout this post*

I think the conflicted nature of Damon's character was present in this version, just more subdued. He has a fixation on the State House that seems to symbolize his more commendable and moral dreams (which is why I actually liked the last shot that a lot of people loathed, with the rat in the foreground and the State House in the background). He also has at least one discussion with his girlfriend about wanting to move away and, I believe, go to law school. And after DiCaprio is killed and Damon eeks out of being exposed as the informant, he states that he's recommending DiCaprio for the badge of merit and paints a very honorable portrait of him -- he seemed to admire him (he also tries to engage his girlfriend in a discussion about their child, clearly taking an interest in it). Also, when Wahlberg comes to kill him at the end, Damon says "Okay", with a hint of resignation, as if he realizes he deserves this fate.

It doesn't sound as if it's nearly as pronounced as it is in IA, but it is there, I think.

I'd forgotten this bit, thanks for mentioning it. Yeah, there's definitely a hint of something there... but I agree, much more subdued. I can't fault Lau for his observation that Damon's character was "absolutely evil". If I had to fall on a side, that's where I'd fall too.

I'm guessing I need to see The Departed again, now, to see what else I've forgotten or missed, but I doubt it will happen until there's a DVD release.