Over the next while, I'm - I mean, The Committee is - going to be figuring out how to proceed with our selection process. Anybody with suggestions, please post them here for due consideration by The Committee.

Some of the things tumbling around in the clothes dryer of my mind...

1)

This shouldn't just be about our favourite films. That could be an interesting list, but it's not this list: I have an unreasoning and utterly subjective affection for JEREMY, Peter evidences a similar fetish for THE FAMILY WAY, but that doesn't mean either of them has any remote reason for being on this list. No, this list is for films we love/admire/recommend that reflect the Arts & Faith focus of the Promontory board. I'm not - I mean, The Committee is not - interested in prescribing some sort of parameter for how explicitly "religious" a film has to be to make the cut, but we're not looking for Our List Of Just Plain Good Movies either - though that could be another interesting list, to be sure. (Using the three categories within the Vatican lists as a point of reference, I'd suggest that we're most interested in the type of films that would fall within the "Religion" category, also interested in "Values" films, but really not looking to include movies just because they'd fit on the "Art" recommendation list.)

So these films have to have some "Faith" element to avoid getting voted off the island, interpret that how you will.

Any further thoughts on how to clarify this enough to be helpful and steer our choices without making it inappropriately restrictive?

2)

To what extent is this our recommendation list of the best-qualified movies for this prestigious recognition, and to what extent is it "the most popular-among-Promontorians faith films" list? I haven't seen ORDET, and there's every possibility it might not do for me what it does for many, but I figure it really ought to make the cut. How do structure the voting/selection process to keep this from being just a tally of the most-widely-seen films? Or the easiest to like films? Conversely, how do we avoid making it a stodgy compilation of all the other lists that Really Important Film Critics say we ought to like, but which don't actually arouse any real enthusiasm around here?

3)

Do we do an initial round of narrowing the field, where people who nominated specific films are entitled to remove them from contention? Or where we challenge (nicely) various nominations and the nominators (and others) give their rationale for inclusion?

4)

Do we weight the voting in any way?

It's possible to weight the voters. By how "informed" their vote is: each person who is going to vote could tell how many of the nominated films they've actually seen, and that could affect the weight of their votes. Or by how "involved" they are with The Prom: we could give more weight to people who are more regular posters here. Hard for these sorts of considerations to be incorporated without offending our democratic instincts, so maybe they're not relevant, but I can also see some value, at least with the first suggestion. If Suzie has seen all three hundred of the nominees, it makes sense to me that her insight into the relative merits of the films carries more weight than Tom's, who's only seen six movies in his life but happened to really like LEFT BEHIND. Any thoughts?

It's possible to weight the votes. Each voter could be given a certain number of points to allocate, and could distribute them as they choose: put ten points each on the ten they REALLY favour, or one point each for a hundred films, or... Or each voter could designate which films the their unconditional support, which get their strong support, which are good possibilities, and which they feel should not be on the list - and each category is given a different vote value. (Hmmm, I kind of like that.) Or they could rank their Top Fifty (or whatever), with their Number One getting proportionately more weight than their Number 50 (though that will be way too finicky for some of our voters, I'm certain).

Lots of other questions come up. Does each person vote for 100 movies? Or does each person vote for ten films, or twenty five, or?....

Is there a series of ballots, narrowing the field? Kind of an elimination tournament of some sort, or the way they do nominations for political party leaders?

5)

Do we want eventually to rank the Top 100, or just list them alphabetically or chronologically?

6)

Is there a place for each Promonotorian to have one or more uncontested appointments to the list? The film(s) which that person believes should be on the list, but which may not be widely known or widely enough appreciated? Is it really a Prom list if it ends up NOT including Jeffrey's Number One Most Spiritual Movie, or SDG's, or yours?

7)

Do we subdivide our hundred into categories, a little like the Vatican did? Could make the list a bit more, I don't know, broad? Inclusive? Decide in advance that we want a certain number of Bible-related films, a certain number of films with significant portrayals of Christian characters, a certain number of "transcendent" films or films with "spiritual themes," or moral/ethical significance, or .... ?

I gotta go.

I'd suggest we take into account our experiences in conversation with moviegoers. Which films have proven most challenging and rewarding in discussion? Which linger in the moviegoers' memories and come up over and over again in non-movie discussions? If we were to host a Promontory Film Critics' Circle Film Festival, which films would we want to feature in our best-of-all-possible festivals, taking into account there would be extensive time for discussion afterwards.

They're not my FAVORITE films, but I'd be putting Ordet, The Son, Code Unknown, and others on the list in a heartbeat.

Oooooh... "weigh the voters." An interesting approach. Perhaps we'll have to consider that for next year's annual PFCC awards.

JO:

: Oooooh... "weigh the voters." An interesting approach. Perhaps we'll
: have to consider that for next year's annual PFCC awards.

So that people whose last names contain both a preposition and a type of roadway get 51 percent of the total available votes?

The Committee:

: Lots of other questions come up. Does each person vote for 100 movies?

Oh please no. Twenty-five will be sufficient, I think.

: Do we want eventually to rank the Top 100, or just list them
: alphabetically or chronologically?

Perhaps a ranking of the top 10 -- for PR reasons -- then the rest either alpha or chrono.

Dale

QUOTE

Perhaps a ranking of the top 10 -- for PR reasons -- then the rest either alpha or chrono.

Logical.

Or do we make this sort of an adjudicated list? Have a little election, to pick a few Promontory regulars to compile the final list. Mix in some democracy: poll everybody about their votes, but then have the "judges" sort through the results and compile a list? They could decide to go back to The Prom At Large to settle particular questions, but they'd be the "editorial board" to put forward the final list.

Or would that involve a whole lot of work for some people who already have way too much to do?

Just thinking out loud.... (Can't you hear my fingers clicking on the keyboard?)

SELECTION PROCESS

STEP 1
Gather nominees from general membership
Done

STEP 2
First Round Acclamation/Elimination process
I invited the ten people with the most posts, plus a couple of relative newcomers who've been posting a lot since they arrived, plus a couple of other obviously core members who maybe don't post as frequently as others, to give me a list of up to 100 films (they are sending me anywhere from 25 to 100 titles) chosen from the nomination list. Somewhere between 30 and 50 titles will end up having drawn the widest support from that group, and will be given secure places on the final list. Also, a whole lot of films will have failed to get the support of more than one (or maybe two) people in that group, and will drop out of contention for this year's list (unless they get reintroduced in Step 5 or Step 6). The remaining films (plus a number of late nominees which have come in since nominations officially closed) will comprise the list of "Electable Films."
All three lists will be posted Saturday April 10

STEP 3
General Free-For-All Discussion about the Electable films
A list of the "Electable" films (all those which have neither been eliminated nor already placed on the final list as a result of Step 2) will be posted for discussion for one week. Advocate for "your" films, challenge others, kick the thing around.
Discussion closes April 16 at midnight.

STEP 4
General Voting
For one week, all participants in the board are invited to send me (by Private Message) their ballot. They will indicate how many of the Electable Films they have seen, which determines how many votes they are allowed to cast. They may then cast up to five votes (or as few as zero votes) for each of the various titles on the Electable Films list. This process will provide a further thirty to fifty titles for the eventual Top 100.
Voting begins April 17, closes April 23 at midnight. Results posted April 24.

STEP 5
Special Jury Selections
The first five steps will have provided 80 or more titles to the final Top 100. Three (?) juries will then deliberate over other titles which should be added to the list from their field of specialty or interest, to round out the list to 100. I'm thinking one jury for art films / world cinema, another for biblical films, another for "soul food" films that for whatever reason just didn't make the cut - too old, too little-known, whatever.
Jury decisions due April 30. Final Top 100 List posted May 1.

STEP 6
"Peculiar Treasures" Selections
I think it would serve to make this list significantly more interesting if we were to supplement our main list of 100 films, arrived at through the above (unnecessarily convoluted) process, with a batch of spiritually significant films that aren't widely enough known (or liked!) to win general voter or jury support, but which have strong advocates within our circle. So we'll also be making up a short list of off-the-beaten-track movies that individuals here want everybody to know about - not just faves, but faves with a distinctly spiritual appeal, even if only for the Enthuser!
Examples. It doesn't look like anybody else is going to vote for my beloved THE YEAR OF LIVING DANGEROUSLY, but it just has to be on the list. Darrel Manson keeps tossing the ROLLERBALL hook in the water, but nobody even nibbles. Matt Page is crazy about SON OF MAN, but which no one but Matt has ever seen. Hal Hartley's BOOK OF LIFE is getting forgotten, but maybe Peter Chattaway wants to soapbox it? Mike Leary seems to think there's something spiritual about that weird DEAD MAN movie, and Mr Prins will never speak to any of us again if THE SON doesn't get mentioned. (Not to say it won't – it's getting votes and everything, but just in case....). You get the idea.
Any time between now and April 30, all board participants are invited to contact me by Private Message to put forward a movie or three which they would like to name to the Peculiar Treasures list, in the eventuality it does not make The Top 100. The selections will be posted along with the Top 100 on Saturday May 1.

STEP 7
Choosing a Top Ten
By this point, we'll probably all be good and sick of the whole process, so I might just name the Top Ten based on a combination of films which were the clear favourites in Steps 2 and 4. More likely, I'll post a list of maybe 20 such candidates, and there can be a general vote to pick the Top Ten. Or maybe we'll decide we don't need to specify a Top Ten, but simply designate certain films that had especially strong support. Who knows. We'll decide when we get there.

STEP 8
Annotating the List
Different suggestions have been made about what to do with the list once we have it. Perhaps set up a separate section of the board with a designated thread for each film. Perhaps post the list (with or without blurbs) on somebody's website. Maybe ask different people to write up a brief blurb about various films. Maybe ask for volunteers to do so for their particular favourites. Whatever seems best. I haven't thought through that part yet, but we'll see if something evolves.

*

Like I said, probably unnecessarily convoluted. But fun. And, having tried out four or five different approaches in the process this year, we can decide (if we do such a thing again) which steps are most valuable, and which can be eliminated.

Your List Dude,


Ron

I wonder if the STP section might be appropriate for the debate period to provide a specific thread movie for each film without cluttering up the board forever. (And them maybe if there were great debates, Alan could move them to the film section when we finish.)

I know I'm not voting (or not for a long time yet), but would Darrel be willing to post a brief (or lengthy) explication of why Rollerball is a "spiritual" film? 'Cause, you know, maybe then more people would go, "Ah! Of course! Why didn't we see that?"

Or if he's already expounded on this topic elsewhere online, perhaps a link?

Thanks!

Ron, you're my special hero for the day.

[quote]Ron, you're my special hero for the day.[/quote]

Before this forum was set up, I started a thread on Rollerball in the film, actors, director section, but it has this discussion in mind. So maybe Alan can move it here when he gets the chance.

I told Chattaway he could have an extension, so I've delayed posting these results. Monday evening or Tuesday, with or without PTC! (Not to mention Jason B, SDG or JBob...)

Ron wrote:
: I told Chattaway he could have an extension, so I've delayed posting
: these results. Monday evening or Tuesday, with or without PTC!

Eh? I e-mailed you my list on Saturday.

[quote]Ron wrote:
: I told Chattaway he could have an extension, so I've delayed posting
: these results. Monday evening or Tuesday, with or without PTC!

Eh? I e-mailed you my list on Saturday.[/quote]
Gotcha. I only checked my Private Messages, not my real email.

Your list is now duly noted, and the results forthcoming.