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Nick Alexander
Saw this last night, the last night of its solitary-week run in suburban Connecticut. Not sure if this is gonna continue its trek to suburbia or is just content to going straight to video.

A very silly movie. It's the perfect venue to introduce tween & teen males to subtitled films. The first twenty minutes of the film are a chore, especially as the cast does an impromptu dance to the beats of Kool-and-the-Gang's "Celebration." Say what??

I'm very pleased that the best parts of the film were not given away by the trailers. There were some nice touches, like having Team Evil's owner played by someone who resembles iconic producer Robert Evans.

Also interesting to figure out why it was delayed for so long. Watching it, I thought it interesting that while the characters all speak Chinese, the writings were all in English, nary a chinese character in sight. This was seemless throughout, and scenes must have been altered digitally, or new cuts had to have been made specifically for the English-release. Of course the songs were probably redone as well.

Lastly, and this is where it can be about faith--a central theme of the film is the lead protagonist's desire to spread the gospel of Shaolin to the masses, his early failed attempts to do so, and his conviction that Shaolin is very appropriate for making one's life better in all walks of life... kinda like "Shaolin Eye for the Straight Guy". I kinda find it interesting that here was an example of a proselytization film that gets its point across even though it uses comic exaggeration and crazy special effects to do so.

I think, comparing this to Evangelical proselytization films, or secular films about Evangelical proselitization, we have either a heavy handed tract where everything is at stake (which, well, _is_), or an ironic jab to proselytize the proselytizers, because... ho, ho, ho... we ALL know better, don't we?

I'm wondering if it's possible to do a good-natured, "light" proseltyization film from the Evangelical context. Certainly worth asking.

Nick
opus
QUOTE
The first twenty minutes of the film are a chore, especially as the cast does an impromptu dance to the beats of Kool-and-the-Gang's "Celebration."  Say what??

Whaaaaa??? On the Hong Kong DVD, this scene (if it's the one I'm thinking of) is obviously an homage/parody to Michael Jackson's "Thriller". However, given Jackson's recent brushes with controversy, I can see why Miramax changed it. But still...

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Also interesting to figure out why it was delayed for so long.

Yeah, you and every Asian film fan on this side of the Pacific. Miramax bought the rights to this film several years ago.

QUOTE
Watching it, I thought it interesting that while the characters all speak Chinese, the writings were all in English, nary a chinese character in sight.  This was seemless throughout, and scenes must have been altered digitally, or new cuts had to have been made specifically for the English-release.  Of course the songs were probably redone as well.

I'll need to watch my HK DVD again, but chances are the onscreen text was digitally altered. God forbid that American viewers have to watch a Chinese film that - gasp - actually contains shreds of Chinese culture. Gotta westernize it up! As for the songs, one of the early rumors was that the movie was going to have a hip-hop soundtrack. Was that the case?

QUOTE
I think, comparing this to Evangelical proselytization films, or secular films about Evangelical proselitization, we have either a heavy handed tract where everything is at stake (which, well, _is_), or an ironic jab to proselytize the proselytizers, because... ho, ho, ho... we ALL know better, don't we?

I wonder if the reason for this is because Shaolin is much more integrated within Chinese culture. In other words, you don't see the same sort of separation between the Shaolin circle and the rest of the culture like you do between Evangelical subcultures and the culture at large. I doubt that there really is a Shaolin "subculture" per se. It's just an accepted part of Chinese culture, which means that people are probably much more comfortable and accepting of it. Hence the many lighthearted films, like Shaolin Soccer, that feature Shaolin in some way, shape, or form - albeit probably in a very diluted, unorthodox form.

On the other hand, the mindset of remaining set apart and separated from the "worldly" culture, which has characterized Evangelicalism by and large (Randall Ballmer makes some interesting observations about this in "Mine Eyes Have Seen The Glory", which I'm currently reading) probably makes it difficult to take proselytization anything but seriously. After all, there are souls at stake, the world is going to hell in a handbasket, etc.

And besides, I'm not sure how you could apply the tenets of Evangelicalism to soccer. You'd probably end up with something akin to that Monty Python sketch about the soccer match between Greek and German philosophers.

Anyhoo, glad to see people are seeing the film (albeit in a bastardized form). I loved this when it came out on DVD (here's my review), and can't wait to see it on the big screen.
Peter T Chattaway
opus wrote:
: I wonder if the reason for this is because Shaolin is much more integrated within
: Chinese culture. In other words, you don't see the same sort of separation
: between the Shaolin circle and the rest of the culture like you do between
: Evangelical subcultures and the culture at large.

So would it be fair to say this film's promotion of Shaolin is less like current evangelical films, and more like those religious films that came out in the 1950s like A Man Called Peter (about a Scottish minister who came to America and became the U.S. Senate chaplain)?
opus
QUOTE (Peter T Chattaway @ May 28 2004, 09:41 AM)
So would it be fair to say this film's promotion of Shaolin is less like current evangelical films, and more like those religious films that came out in the 1950s like A Man Called Peter (about a Scottish minister who came to America and became the U.S. Senate chaplain)?

Well I can't say for sure, since I haven't seen too many (if any) of those films you mentioned. However, I think that's probably more the case.
opus
Not sure what this adds to the discussion at hand, but thought I'd throw it out anyway. When Shaolin Soccer was first released, IIRC, it actually ran into a bit of trouble because authorities thought it poked too much fun at Shaolin (I couldn't find any articles to back that up, but I'll keep digging). Which I find somewhat odd, considering that Asian cinema is full of over-the-top monk characters, as well as evil monks (All Men Are Brothers: Blood of the Leopard, Iron Monkey, Chinese Ghost Story, etc.). Perhaps it was the film's gall to apply Shaolin techniques, powers, etc. to mundane events (like parking your car or not slipping on a banana peel).

Of course, the film still went to become the most profitable HK film ever, grossing HK$60 million (US$7.7 million) locally.
Nick Alexander
QUOTE
Whaaaaa???  On the Hong Kong DVD, this scene (if it's the one I'm thinking of) is obviously an homage/parody to Michael Jackson's "Thriller".  However, given Jackson's recent brushes with controversy, I can see why Miramax changed it.  But still...
Don't forget that "13 Going on 30" already has a "Thriller" dance-a-long. It could've been a last minute change so that folks wouldn't think one was copying from the other, altho that's probably exactly what happened. Who knows? All I know is that while the original "Thriller" video was an all-out deserved hit, I never knew anybody or of any rage to dance exactly those moves in public. Am I missing something?

Come to think of it, seeing the fire light up in all these folks' eyes kinda makes sense with Thriller, not so much with Celebration. But what else would they use? Eye In The Sky? Eyes Without A Face? Bette Davis' Eyes? How about Pat Benatar's "Fire and Eyes"? (ooh. Stop when I'm ahead).

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As for the songs, one of the early rumors was that the movie was going to have a hip-hop soundtrack.  Was that the case?
There are a few hip-hop remakes, like "Kung Fu Fighting", played in the final street scene. But the film really didn't have too many songs in it to be intruded by any deviance of taste. (It was bad enough during that lounge scene).

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I wonder if the reason for this is because Shaolin is much more integrated within Chinese culture.  In other words, you don't see the same sort of separation between the Shaolin circle and the rest of the culture like you do between Evangelical subcultures and the culture at large.
Hmm. I don't think that's the case. Using "Lost in Translation" as a template, I would suggest that Shaolin as a lifestyle was being usurped by technological advances and Western materialism.

I think the difference lies in the forms themselves: Shaolin is both secular and religious, being secular as a form of exercise/self-defence, and religious in its underpinnings, whereas Christianity is a religion without a secular counterpart (unless you count in those happy-happy-joy-joy songs of P.O.D. and Switchfoot). Granted, you can probably go throughout all of Christian art in history and find examples of such that are pleasing on a secular level while delivering a religious message, or you can find inspiring sports figures who happen to be Christians, but my mind is otherwise drawing a blank: perhaps that's the point--Christianity is not reliant upon a single outward expression, but is wholly integrated with the whole Body of Christ, (pornographers and assisted suicide doctors excepted).

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And besides, I'm not sure how you could apply the tenets of Evangelicalism to soccer.
On a light note, I think a film which details someone becoming so absolutely "perfect" the moment he/she has a born-again experience that the person becomes superhuman, spouting out Bible verses while rescuing baby carriages from going down hills, something like that. Perhaps such a film would have Falwell & co. learn the value of satire.

BTW, nice review.

Nick
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