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Peter T Chattaway

Who Framed Roger Rabbit 2

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Link to the 'Least Anticipated Sequels' thread, where this film has come up before.

Link to the September 20 CartoonBrew.com post which included the following CGI screen test from 1998; it also includes a comment from animator Eric Goldberg, who directed the sequence:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u0hNbcJO6EM

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Bob Hoskins is animated about Who Framed Roger Rabbit sequel
With its innovative mix of live action and animation, Who Framed Roger Rabbit was one of the best-loved films of the Eighties and helped to establish Bob Hoskins as an international star.
The 67-year-old actor has now agreed to appear in a sequel, but he would appear to have reservations about the fact that this film will be fully animated.
"I don't know how it's going to work out," Hoskins admitted to Mandrake at the premiere of Made in Dagenham, at the Odeon Leicester Square in London.
"The format they want to do is the same as we did for A Christmas Carol. The thing is, it looks like a cartoon, so how do you put a cartoon in the middle of a cartoon? I can't figure out how they are going to do it." . . .
Daily Telegraph, September 22

Edited by Peter T Chattaway

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Didn't want to start a whole new thread with this news, so this seemed the logical place to put this.

Bob Hoskins has announced his retirement after being diagnosed late last year with Parkinson disease. I recently (well, around Christmas) rewatched Hoskins in Mona Lisa, one of my favorite performances by him. The scene where he wears the Droopy Dog mask is truly exceptional. He's only able to use body language to convey his complete heartbreak, and nails it perfectly.

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His retirement is a real blow. I didn't like everything he was in, but I can't remember a film where his presence didn't improve the overall end product.

His retirement is a real blow. I didn't like everything he was in, but I can't remember a film where his presence didn't improve the overall end product.

EDIT: Can't the Who Framed Roger Rabbit? tech genuises just impose an image of Hoskins' face over a double and still have him "star" in the sequel?

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Exclusive: A “Roger Rabbit” Sequel May Happen After All, Says Director

Zemeckis told me last night that, although he’s sad about the retirement of Bob Hoskins, he has a “Who Framed Roger Rabbit?” ready to go. The brilliant 1988 combination live action and animation film has been begging for a sequel forever. “I have a script at Disney, and we’re just waiting for all the executive changes to settle down there,” Zemeckis told me. If I know Alan Horn, that’s a project he’ll get moving quickly. What great news! . . .

Roger Friedman, October 15

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Cartoon Brew has some interesting behind-the-scenes anecdotes in anticipation of the film's 25th anniversary, e.g.:

We have heard about
Who framed Roger Rabbit
having way more special effects than
Star Wars
, but it was also one of the last of the great ‘optical’ effects films. It was a different era.

Zemeckis reminisced that, “we had FedEx and ¾” tape – we had technology by the tail.” He spoke about the first finished animation that came over from the London studio unit. It was the portion of the introductory
Something Cookin’
cartoon in which the chili sauce falls off the shelf in Roger’s kettle-head. The British animators spelled ‘chili’ in the British manner, with two l’s (‘chilli’). The scene had to be completely re-animated.

In the scene which the camera trucks over the newspaper headlines showing the Toon cases solved by Valiant & Valiant on Eddie’s desk, the London studio had used the banners of LA newspapers of the time (1947), without having asked permission of the newspapers. One newspaper ended up refusing permission to use their banner – and this complicated scene had to be completely re-shot. . . .

Reminiscent of all the stories one hears about the analogue methods that had to be used in the making of Tron (printing out code, carrying it over to another computer, and re-entering the data, etc....).

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A little over ten years ago I had attended one of Richard Williams Animation Masterclasses. Richard Williams of course being the director of Roger Rabbit, as well as animating the intro cartoon scene. He spoke breifly about making Roger Rabbit and at that time he owned a British Studio which was working on commercial work, and of course began on Roger Rabbit. Between projects they were plugging away at what would eventually become the Thief and the Cobbler (although the studios took it from them to finish and butchered it - which is another story.)

So some of Roger Rabbit was produced in the English studio, where legendary animator Ken Harris had been teaching animators, as well as working on segments of THE THIEF AND THE COBBLER. At the seminar Richard Williams mentioned that he was animating the intro scene with an old school sense of perfection, trying to get it just right, when one of the higher ups told him to quit making it so well done, he was spending too much time on it and it was starting to look too much of a better quality than the rest of the film.

Richard Williams had been trained under the likes of animation masters such as Milt Kahl and he has always very much tried to achieve their level of quality and understanding of the medium, but it often got him in trouble with the studio system that was concerned to get the films finished on time and budget. Which is part of the reason the studio took THE THIEF AND THE COBBLER from him. He implied that there was some of the same confict while making Roger Rabbit.

In fact near the end they were in such a rush to meet the deadlines that they more or less brought in very newbie animators, basically off of the street, in order to help get the film finished.

When it was all said and done Williams showed the film to some of his old Disney mentors, and he said that their response wasn't entirely positive. They said that it lacked heart.

But of course he went on to win an Academy Award as its director.

FWIW. After the seminar a few of us went out for a beer with Richard and I was able to chat him up briefly. He was a completely likeable and funny guy. Some people in animation circles viewed him as eccentric, but I saw him as being passionate. He was/is passionate about the artform, and was/is one of the main people keeping the flame alive, to try and keep to the quality of animation that was achieved by the greats such as Milt Kahl and the other animators who were his mentors and were working to bring Disney to the level of animation quality that it had during its heyday.

Williams is basically one of the main animators that had his foot in both the Old School animation, and they new work that is being made now, and WHO FRAMED ROGER RABBIT in at least some ways represents this.

By the way. The Theif and the Cobbler is worth renting. It is most definately flawed, seeing as some of it was finished by hacks (and the story was altered) after it was taken from Williams. But it also boasts some of the most incredibly beautiful hand drawn animation known to man. I kid you not.

Edited by Attica

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By the way. The Theif and the Cobbler is worth renting. It is most definately flawed, seeing as some of it was finished by hacks (and the story was altered) after it was taken from Williams. But it also boasts some of the most incredibly beautiful hand drawn animation known to man. I kid you not.

Or you could watch the "Recobbled" version and miss out on the ridiculous, jarring musical numbers. :)

http://www.vmresource.com/thief/workprint.html

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By the way. The Theif and the Cobbler is worth renting. It is most definately flawed, seeing as some of it was finished by hacks (and the story was altered) after it was taken from Williams. But it also boasts some of the most incredibly beautiful hand drawn animation known to man. I kid you not.

Or you could watch the "Recobbled" version and miss out on the ridiculous, jarring musical numbers. smile.png

http://www.vmresourc.../workprint.html

At one time I had a DVD of the recobbled version, work in progress. Not sure where it went. It benefits, of course, from some of the bad animation taken out, but also from the yappy voiceover taken out. That was the most annoying part. The whole intent of the film was to have the thief a silent character where his character was conveyed soley through pantomime, thus a pure expression of the animated artform. The studio got scared and threw on the stupid voiceover of his thoughts (and yes some of it is really dumb), thus making a mockery of the original intentions, turning it into pretty much the opposite of what was intended.

The studio taking that film from Williams is one of the most horrific stories in the film industry. They had been working on that film since the early 70's, many people who had seen clips thought that it was absolutely remarkable. Then after 20 years or so working on the film a studio offered them money to finish it, only to eventually take it from them after they had signed it over, then make a hack job of it.

When I was at the seminar Richard asked us to please not mention it or ask questions about it. He was still stinging some 5 years after its release.

Edited by Attica

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Richard Williams had been trained under the likes of animation masters such as Milt Kahl and he has always very much tried to achieve their level of quality and understanding of the medium.....

I always loved this little exchange from The Animator's Survival Kit, that a young Williams had with Milt Kahl.....

WorkingWithMusic1.jpg

11kjzb5.png

Edited by John Drew

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The Animator's Survival kit was based on the workshop that I had attended. After he had done a few workshops he eventually turned the material into a book. The workshop had a few stories that never made the book, as people asked questions and he simply rolled with some of his responses. He had implied that Milt Kahl was kind of a rough type of guy, as seen in the cartoon, but underneath had a heart of gold and loved that Williams was so interested in really learning from him and mastering the craft. He had tremendous respect for Milt and thought that he was the greatest animator that ever lived. He also thought that everybody knew it, and resented Milt a little. After Milt retired from Disney Williams would still go and hang out with him. If I remember right Milt moved into a passion for fly fishing and painting.

During those Seminars Williams had mentioned that he was working on a independent short film, and for years since I've been wondering if he would ever finish it, and wanting to eventually see it. Turns out the this year a new updated version of the Animator's Survival Kit has been released, and the short film is going to be included with the package. There's just no way that it won't be an absolutely remarkable piece of animation.

By the way. Williams also said that he had been animating for years on commercial work through his own successful studio, and those old Disney animators still didn't consider him to be a real animator. He showed us a clip from TTATC that he had animated, and said that it wasn't until he had played this clip to those Disney guys that they finally said that he was a true animation artist. The clip was incredibly good, which shows how high their standards are. I think of that when I see so much of the modern stuff that is being touted as "well made" animation.

As said before, many think that Richard was one of the main transitions between the old school and the new. Through that masterclass he passed on some of that old school to me, and I'm thankful for that.

Oh, and the Masterclass was in Greenwich village New York, and I had lots of fun hanging out around there and in other parts of Manhattan, between the classes. That was a couple of years before the towers fell.

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Hoskins has died.

 

 

British actor Bob Hoskins, whose varied career ranged from noir drama "Mona Lisa" to animated fantasy "Who Framed Roger Rabbit" has died aged 71.

 

A family statement released Wednesday by agent Clair Dobbs said Hoskins died in a hospital after a bout of pneumonia.

 

A versatile character actor capable of menace, quiet poignancy and Cockney charm, London-raised Hoskins appeared in some of the most acclaimed British films of the past few decades, including gangster classic "The Long Good Friday."

 

He specialized in tough guys with a soft center, including the ex-con who chaperones Cathy Tyson's escort in Neil Jordan's 1986 film "Mona Lisa." Hoskins was nominated for a best-actor Academy Award for the role.

 

His Hollywood breakthrough came as a detective investigating cartoon crime in the part-animated 1988 hit "Who Framed Roger Rabbit." He also played the pirate Smee in Steven Spielberg's 1991 Peter Pan movie "Hook."

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An excerpt from a 1983 Disney Channel show on the development of Who Framed Roger Rabbit, including some pencil tests voiced by Paul Reubens (before he became Pee-Wee Herman).

 

This clip dates to a time *before* Eisner and Katzenberg took over the Disney studio in 1984, and *before* Robert Zemeckis got involved with the film, the final version of which came out in 1988.

 

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Watched "Molly's Game" (2017) last night. Jessica Chastain looks spooky in her plastic surgery, and is a Jessica Rabbit look-a-like. From different angles during the movie I didn't hardly recognize her. Fitting for crime-drama-gambling genre movie. Doesn't quite fit Disney. Maybe "Molly's Game" is the sequel :)  Probably not what we were expecting though.

2016 article

 

Disney owns that script and, as Zemeckis explains it, “the current corporate Disney culture has no interest in Roger, and they certainly don’t like Jessica at all.”

Zemeckis points out, sequels are really freakin’ hard to get right: "Most sequels, you’re behind the eight-ball on them.... If it’s too similar, they don’t like it. And if it’s too different, they really don’t like it."

https://www.slashfilm.com/roger-rabbit-sequel/

jessica-chastain-molly-s-game-premiere-at-afi-fest-in-la-11-16-2017-15.jpg

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