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Star Wars: Episode VII - The Force Awakens (2015)


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: Heck, it wasn't too much longer ago than that that the US Armed Services were segregated.

 

It *has* been observed (correctly?) that the Empire isn't a particularly integrated institution itself. I don't think we ever see any alien species in their ranks (Vader's hiring of the bounty hunters notwithstanding), and it's possible all the human officers were basically Caucasian, too.

 

Yeah, the OT Empire is so distinctly white-male that it became a kind of key point in the Zahn books, for instance (Thrawn is apparently the only non-human officer in the Imperial Starfleet). Of course, that's a good thirty years before the new series picks up--which is why I brought up the US Army's history of segregation in the first place. There's so much time between the PT and the OT and between the OT and the ST that just about any change in the universe is accounted for (kind of like the shift from gosh-wow streamlined tech in the PT to the used universe look in the OT, though admittedly there the production design of the PT went out of its way to start phasing toward the used universe, particularly in EIII).

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I don't think the Empire was ever whites only, just humans only. I never read anything in the EU that points towards them being whites only. The whole thing with Thrawn is because he's an alien.

There are clones in Timothy Zahn's trilogy too that have nothing to do with Jango Fett. I think that after the Fett clones were such a success they began cloning other top ranking officials that performed well in combat. At least we're never told who the clones are clones of in Heir to the Empire trilogy, but the cover makes them all look white. This is of course from the Clone Wars, and I don't think has anything to do with the stormtroopers of the days of The Rebellion and the OT. In fact, in the comics, Luke and Co. meet a clone trooper, Able, and they treat him as a character from the past, and not as just another trooper from the present.

I think all the troopers in OT are just normal guys. Yes this is never explicitly spelt out, but we can assume?

If we're going with just the movies as continuity then I still think there's room to think the cloning has tapered off between PT and OT, and this new trilogy is even further ahead in time.

But we'll see when the movie comes out.

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I don't think the Empire was ever whites only, just humans only. I never read anything in the EU that points towards them being whites only. The whole thing with Thrawn is because he's an alien.

 

It's been years, but that does ring a bell. At the same time, I think it's true that the only Imperial officers we see in the OT are all white. Then again, there's apparently about three, maybe four [EDIT: Correction--there seem to be five], black men in the entire Star Wars universe (OT and PT, and that's allowing for background extras), so....

Edited by NBooth
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NBooth wrote:
: Then again, there's apparently about three, maybe four [EDIT: Correction--there seem to be five], black men in the entire Star Wars universe (OT and PT, and that's allowing for background extras), so....

 

Lando Calrissian, Mace Windu, and...?

"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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NBooth wrote:

: Then again, there's apparently about three, maybe four [EDIT: Correction--there seem to be five], black men in the entire Star Wars universe (OT and PT, and that's allowing for background extras), so....

 

Lando Calrissian, Mace Windu, and...?

 

Lando, Mace, and Captain Panaka were the ones I thought of immediately. Going by Yahoo Answers, there's also a rebel pilot in RotJ named Grizz Frix and a senator in the PT named Giddean Danu. And if we really push it, Ahmed Best had a cameo in the nightclub scene in AotC.

 

Grizz Frix:

 

Then again, there's apparently about three, maybe four [EDIT: Correction--there seem to be five], black men in the entire Star Wars universe (OT and PT, and that's allowing for background extras), so....

Which makes Boyega's casting as the lead of this new trilogy all the more welcome.

 

 

Absolutely agreed.

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NBooth wrote:
: Lando, Mace, and Captain Panaka were the ones I thought of immediately.

 

Oh, right, I remember thinking of Panaka during an earlier phase of this discussion (not necessarily here at A&F, but the broader discussion).

"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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I don't think the Empire was ever whites only, just humans only. I never read anything in the EU that points towards them being whites only. The whole thing with Thrawn is because he's an alien.

There are clones in Timothy Zahn's trilogy too that have nothing to do with Jango Fett. I think that after the Fett clones were such a success they began cloning other top ranking officials that performed well in combat. At least we're never told who the clones are clones of in Heir to the Empire trilogy, but the cover makes them all look white. This is of course from the Clone Wars, and I don't think has anything to do with the stormtroopers of the days of The Rebellion and the OT. In fact, in the comics, Luke and Co. meet a clone trooper, Able, and they treat him as a character from the past, and not as just another trooper from the present.

I think all the troopers in OT are just normal guys. Yes this is never explicitly spelt out, but we can assume?

If we're going with just the movies as continuity then I still think there's room to think the cloning has tapered off between PT and OT, and this new trilogy is even further ahead in time.

But we'll see when the movie comes out.

 

Granted, this is the EU, but one of the stormtroopers (sandtroopers) on Tatooine looking for the droids has been given the name David Felth, along with a significant backstory.

 

It's amazing to think of how much EU material was produced over the last three decades. Zahn's trilogy was really the kindling for all the EU I believe.

He finds no mercy

And he's lost in the crowd

With an armoured heart of metal

He finds he's running out of odd-numbered daisies

From which to pull the petals

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winter shaker wrote:
: Zahn's trilogy was really the kindling for all the EU I believe.

 

I'd push it even earlier, to the role-playing game released in the late '80s (when I was at Bible school). Zahn himself said he relied on that game as reference material when writing his books.

 

And if memory serves, the back-story given to Han Solo in that game claimed that he *used* to be a stormtrooper, but at some point -- probably connected to his first encounter with Chewbacca -- he quit the Imperial forces. For whatever that's worth.

"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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Is Splinter of the Mind's Eye not considered part of the EU?

 

Yes, but it's historically been even less in-continuity than other parts of the franchise (having a scene where Luke eyes up Leia will do that).

 

[Edited because, frankly, I consider even non-continuity stuff canon, since the movies and books and games have regularly swapped concepts around. If it's usable, it's canon. Either way, the book's still EU]

Edited by NBooth
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That video isn't available in Canada, with this message.  "Sorry, but this video is unavailable from your location, probably due to your overly polite attitudes."       Ha ha.

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"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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winter shaker wrote:

: Zahn's trilogy was really the kindling for all the EU I believe.

 

I'd push it even earlier, to the role-playing game released in the late '80s (when I was at Bible school). Zahn himself said he relied on that game as reference material when writing his books.

 

And if memory serves, the back-story given to Han Solo in that game claimed that he *used* to be a stormtrooper, but at some point -- probably connected to his first encounter with Chewbacca -- he quit the Imperial forces. For whatever that's worth.

 

I recall borrowing some compiled comic books from the library that were set between ANH and ESB. The Bounty Hunter of Ord Mantell was one. I remember enjoying them, but definitely another early EU product.

He finds no mercy

And he's lost in the crowd

With an armoured heart of metal

He finds he's running out of odd-numbered daisies

From which to pull the petals

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I can't get the video to embed, but Colbert's take on the new trailer is well worth watching.

 

http://thecolbertreport.cc.com/videos/umsrnb/lightsaber-controversy

Edited by Evan C

"Anyway, in general I love tragic artists, especially classical ones."

"Even the forms for expressing truth can be multiform, and this is indeed necessary for the transmission of the Gospel in its timeless meaning."

- Pope Francis, August 2013 interview with Antonio Spadaro

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I can't get the video to embed, but Colbert's take on the new trailer is well worth watching.

 

http://thecolbertreport.cc.com/videos/umsrnb/lightsaber-controversy

 

See post #488.

 

 

In other news:

 

P.S.  I COULD BE WRONG.

 

Takin' 'er easy for all you sinners at lookingcloser.org. Also abiding at Facebook and Twitter.

 

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  • 4 weeks later...

Twitch is reporting 3 actors from The Raid movies (including Iko Uwais, who played Rama) will be in The Force Awakens.

I haven't located anything on YouTube, so I wonder when news of this spreads if some enterprising person will add lightsabers to some of the fight scenes in The Raid.

Formerly Baal_T'shuvah

"Everyone has the right to make an ass out of themselves. You just can't let the world judge you too much." - Maude 
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This web site posted a list of Episode 7 themed toys, and one of them is a Darth Vader mask.  ?  I think the toy line has always incorporated stuff from the previous films, so maybe this means nothing. But if this does relate to Ep. 7, it's going to be interesting to find out how Vader sprang back to life, leaped off the funeral pyre, and salvaged his helmet.  Or maybe there will be flashbacks.

 

http://www.flickeringmyth.com/2015/01/star-wars-force-awakens-toy-line-reveals-return-major-character.html

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