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Sara

How did A&F website/forum begin?

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Sara... why TELL you the history when we can DEMONSTRATE it so succinctly?

And (probably for the best) Doug is showing remarkable restraint here, not taking any bait (intentional or otherwise).

I really did want to know about the history of A&F. And I did not know it had such a long history. Many of you have been a part of this for a long time.

I would not have expected this long and strong a forum to have emerged "pain free."

But we are still together!

Thanks for telling me about how it began and grew - and is still going on.

I am glad to be here.

Sara

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Things have improved a lot, and I think we've all learned lessons and grown.

I for one am very glad that the Chiaroscuro messages are no longer in the public domain. I seem to recall saying things like: "I just saw Magnolia last night and adored how cool it was. Were those frogs or something? I just rented a movie called Wild Strawberries. Is that any good?"

Let's list the "oldies."
Edited by MLeary

"...the vivid crossing of borders between film and theology may save the film from the banality of cinema and festival business, and it may also save the church from the deep sleep of the habitual and the always known."

(Hans Werner Dannowski)

Filmwell | Twitter

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Outline of our History:

rec.music.christian/Movies and Ministry/Film Forum -> OnFilm Yahoo D-list by PT

OnFilm Yahoo D-list hive off/Decent Films/Promontory/Flickerings -> Chiaroscuro/Film Forum Discussion (affectionately referred to as the "reverse implosion" list by Stef)

Chiaroscuro/Film Forum -> Novogate "Film and Spirituality Discussion Board" (out of which came the infamous Chicago Novogate Film and Spirituality Discussion Board Group, still rumored to be in existence, and of which Dan Buck at one time was an honorary member for saying something funny).

Novogate F and S -> Promontory Film and Spirituality Discussion Board

Promontory F and S -> Promontory Arts and Spirituality Discussion Board

Promontory A and S -> Arts and Faith


"...the vivid crossing of borders between film and theology may save the film from the banality of cinema and festival business, and it may also save the church from the deep sleep of the habitual and the always known."

(Hans Werner Dannowski)

Filmwell | Twitter

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I was part of onFilm and Novogate.
Edited by MLeary

"...the vivid crossing of borders between film and theology may save the film from the banality of cinema and festival business, and it may also save the church from the deep sleep of the habitual and the always known."

(Hans Werner Dannowski)

Filmwell | Twitter

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I would not have expected this long and strong a forum to have emerged "pain free."

But we are still together!

We have even been around long enough to develop a canon (the A&F top 100) that even all of the longstanding members have participated in.


"...the vivid crossing of borders between film and theology may save the film from the banality of cinema and festival business, and it may also save the church from the deep sleep of the habitual and the always known."

(Hans Werner Dannowski)

Filmwell | Twitter

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I remember poor Dale as one of the pillars of our earlier manifestations. I grieve how rarely we engage with him now. He remains, for me, the Michel Gondry of discussion-board posters.

Edited by Jeffrey Overstreet

P.S.  I COULD BE WRONG.

 

Takin' 'er easy for all you sinners at lookingcloser.org. Also abiding at Facebook, Twitter, and Google+.

 

"Forget it, Jake. It's Funkytown."    

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If Peter were standing here beside me, I'd ask this question while smiling good-naturedly and tussling his hair. I promise I mean no offense. But can any of you remember a single argument (excluding the "politics" area) in which Peter was not involved?

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Actually, I remember having a rather long, elaborate tangle with Doug that, at the time, I was grateful that Peter let Doug and I work through it on our own.

Let's try to steer things back to the History of the Board and away from the History of Debates on the Board.

Edited by Jeffrey Overstreet

P.S.  I COULD BE WRONG.

 

Takin' 'er easy for all you sinners at lookingcloser.org. Also abiding at Facebook, Twitter, and Google+.

 

"Forget it, Jake. It's Funkytown."    

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Oh, Dale, I remember you very fondly. I smile at the memory of how you revised the title of my second-favorite movie of all time to "periwinkle" something or other. But you were never an administrator. I confess, my account focused on the elites. smile.gif

BTW, if I didn't go into as much detail on the progression from Novogate to PF to PA to A&F, it's partly because I'm not really sure why the changes happened, there. The previous changes were all precipitated by obvious glitches in the board, but I think the reasons for the later changes were more subtle, or hidden to all but the administrator(s). Plus, from PF on, all the threads have stayed "active", so the line dividing the various boards isn't as sharply drawn, there.

Russ, there's a difference between a thumbnail and a textbook. But if it's footnotes you want, trust me, I've got the material!

Re: arguments, I seem to recall narrowly missing out on a huge fight-in-the-making over Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the Clones, back in the Novogate days. Let's just say that an entire thread was deleted somewhere between the time I began reading it and the time when I considered replying to it. (I might have contributed a post or two to the early part of that thread, but I believe I had been away for a while when the storm really got brewing.) That movie REALLY stirred up some passions. I distinctly remember wondering if I was "losing my faith in Star Wars".

Edited by Peter T Chattaway

"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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Re: arguments, I seem to recall narrowly missing out on a huge fight-in-the-making over Star Wars: Episode II - Attack of the Clones, back in the Novogate days.  Let's just say that an entire thread was deleted somewhere between the time I began reading it and the time when I considered replying to it.  (I might have contributed a post or two to the early part of that thread, but I believe I had been away for a while when the storm really got brewing.)  That movie REALLY stirred up some passions.  I distinctly remember wondering if I was "losing my faith in Star Wars".

IIRC, that was the one fight that I was involved in personally and got really upset about (suprrise, surprise it involved Star Wars). Ah, good to know I've made a contribution to "history." wink.gif


"A director must live with the fact that his work will be called to judgment by someone who has never seen a film of Murnau's." - François Truffaut

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Reviews and essays at Three Brothers Film.

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I'm wondering if everyone could do me a favor? For those who included my full name in their post, could you edit it to say "Doug" or "Doug C" instead? I don't want to be widely associated with the content of this thread.

Thank you.

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Hmmm, so to use Russ's "totalitarian regimes" metaphor, it seems some people airbrush themselves out of the history books? smile.gif


"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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Ha, yeah. Henceforth, I want to be called/referred to/thought of as Jose Feliciano.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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I was part of onFilm and Novogate.  But no one remembers poor Dale.

Yeah, I'd forgotten about you, cos I was too busy wonering what happened to that guy Donald Napolean Sprim from the Novogate days?

Matt

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This really does feel like a family. It's about as pleasant as Thanskgiving at my own home.

Exasperating, but I wouldn't be who I am if it weren't for these folks.

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I don't want to be widely associated with the content of this thread.

Oh don't worry! To alter a popular slogan, "What you do on the Internet stays on the Internet." biggrin.gif


P.S.  I COULD BE WRONG.

 

Takin' 'er easy for all you sinners at lookingcloser.org. Also abiding at Facebook, Twitter, and Google+.

 

"Forget it, Jake. It's Funkytown."    

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Aaaaand wondering why this thread is not closed...


Brandon

"God is so great and merciful that he does not require that we name him precisely. God is even willing to be anonymous for a time. Remember how God led the Three Wise Men from the East to Christ? The Wise Men did not know the God of Israel or Jesus. They worshipped the stars. So God used a star to lure them."--The Twelve Steps for Christians

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Frankly, I fail to see how any of these disputes have any relevance to the question asked. It could have been the case that a chronology is all that is needed to be shown and leave it at that. If the disputes are significant to the founding of or the history of how A&F started, then state it in such a way as to not bring on more contention. Again, I fail to see their significance.

Edited by BBBCanada

Brandon

"God is so great and merciful that he does not require that we name him precisely. God is even willing to be anonymous for a time. Remember how God led the Three Wise Men from the East to Christ? The Wise Men did not know the God of Israel or Jesus. They worshipped the stars. So God used a star to lure them."--The Twelve Steps for Christians

myspace-animation-codes121.gif

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Frankly, I fail to see how any of these disputes have any relevance to the question asked.  It could have been the case that a chronology is all that  is needed to be shown and leave it at that.  If the disputes are significant to the founding of or the history of how A&F started, then state it in such a way as to not bring on more contention.  Again, I fail to see their significance.

That's 'cuz you're a poopy-head.

wink.gif

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If Peter were standing here beside me, I'd ask this question while smiling good-naturedly and tussling his hair.  I promise I mean no offense.  But can any of you remember a single argument (excluding the "politics" area) in which Peter was not involved?

I've had a few that I was involved in early on. However Darren, thanks for this post. Nice setup for the zinger. Now if we can all poke each other like this....


"During the contest trial, the Coleman team presented evidence of a further 6500 absentees that it felt deserved to be included under the process that had produced the prior 933 [submitted by Franken, rk]. The three judges finally defined what constituted a 'legal' absentee ballot. Countable ballots, for instance, had to contain the signature of the voter, complete registration information, and proper witness credentials.

But the panel only applied the standards going forward, severely reducing the universe of additional basentees the Coleman team could hope to have included. In the end, the three judges allowed about 350 additional absentees to be counted. The panel also did nothing about the hundreds, possibly thousands, of absentees that have already been legally included, yet are now 'illegal' according to the panel's own ex-post definition."

The Wall Street Journal editorial, April 18, 2009 concerning the Franken Coleman decision in the Minnesota U.S. Senate race of 2008.

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Frankly, I fail to see how any of these disputes have any relevance to the question asked.
Edited by Rich Kennedy

"During the contest trial, the Coleman team presented evidence of a further 6500 absentees that it felt deserved to be included under the process that had produced the prior 933 [submitted by Franken, rk]. The three judges finally defined what constituted a 'legal' absentee ballot. Countable ballots, for instance, had to contain the signature of the voter, complete registration information, and proper witness credentials.

But the panel only applied the standards going forward, severely reducing the universe of additional basentees the Coleman team could hope to have included. In the end, the three judges allowed about 350 additional absentees to be counted. The panel also did nothing about the hundreds, possibly thousands, of absentees that have already been legally included, yet are now 'illegal' according to the panel's own ex-post definition."

The Wall Street Journal editorial, April 18, 2009 concerning the Franken Coleman decision in the Minnesota U.S. Senate race of 2008.

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BBBCanada wrote:

: Frankly, I fail to see how any of these disputes have any relevance to the question

: asked. It could have been the case that a chronology is all that is needed to be

: shown and leave it at that.

Historians don't merely look at WHAT happened, they look at WHY it happened. And I personally think it's really interesting to see how people started something, and then stopped something, and then started something else, etc., etc. Those stories can be pretty interesting.

And as far as I can tell, the closest I came to mentioning a "dispute" in my original post was when I said that Doug found the OnFilm forum "a bit too lowbrow" several years ago, but even THAT isn't really contentious. It's just a fact. And I don't think Doug would disagree with that. I said nothing about the manner in which the differences between Doug and the rest of the OnFilm group were EXPRESSED, precisely because that would take us into less objective and more contentious territory. It was only after Alan and stef raised the "personal" issue that I responded on those points.


"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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FWIW, I won't protest the name-deletion thing in this case, Alan, but when people publish their own words under their own names (as Doug certainly did, using his full name at OnFilm and most if not all of his own sites), then those associations are a matter of public record, period, and I don't see any point in suppressing references to those things later on. I'd hate for us to get to the point where someone quoting one of Doug's website reviews via an online archive, and attributing the author by his actual credited name, ended up being censored for it.


"Sympathy must precede belligerence. First I must understand the other, as it were, from the inside; then I can critique it from the outside. So many people skip right to the latter." -- Steven D. Greydanus
Now blogging at Patheos.com. I can also still be found at Facebook, Twitter and Flickr. See also my film journal.

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