243 replies to this topic

[Timothy Zila]

Ryan H., on 16 March 2012 - 09:06 PM, said:

So I've seen the first two episodes, and I really don't get what all the fuss is about. So far I've seen a lot of flat writing, stilted direction, and poor performances (to say nothing of the thoroughly cliche production design and score). I understand that the first two episodes aren't the best, but really, I didn't expect them to be so mediocre. Not even Sean Bean brings life to the proceedings. If it weren't for Peter Dinklage, I'd have died of boredom.

Watch episode three. If you don't like that, I don't know what to say to you.

This show is amazing though, way better than I was expecting. It gets more dynamic the further in you get. The characters are all complex (even though they seem flat in the first few episodes), and stuff starts happening.

I love Dinklage too, but he's far from the only good thing on the show.

[Ryan H.]

Timothy Zila, on 17 March 2012 - 08:02 AM, said:

Ryan H., on 16 March 2012 - 09:06 PM, said:

So I've seen the first two episodes, and I really don't get what all the fuss is about. So far I've seen a lot of flat writing, stilted direction, and poor performances (to say nothing of the thoroughly cliche production design and score). I understand that the first two episodes aren't the best, but really, I didn't expect them to be so mediocre. Not even Sean Bean brings life to the proceedings. If it weren't for Peter Dinklage, I'd have died of boredom.

Watch episode three. If you don't like that, I don't know what to say to you.

Oh, I will. My wife is dead-set on watching the whole thing, and I'll be watching it with her.

But I'd be lying right now if I didn't say that, based on the dreary first two episodes, I'd rather go back and watch ROME again.

[Nathaniel]

Ryan H., on 17 March 2012 - 08:17 AM, said:

My wife is dead, and I'll be with her if I go back and watch ROME again.

Ryan, did you really mean this, or am I deliberately misquoting you?

[Ryan H.]

Nathaniel, on 18 March 2012 - 03:03 AM, said:

Ryan H., on 17 March 2012 - 08:17 AM, said:

My wife is dead, and I'll be with her if I go back and watch ROME again.

Ryan, did you really mean this, or am I deliberately misquoting you?

I did actually scour my post to make sure I hadn't accidentally typed that.

Edited by Ryan H., 18 March 2012 - 08:51 AM.

[Nathaniel]

Ryan H., on 18 March 2012 - 08:51 AM, said:

Nathaniel, on 18 March 2012 - 03:03 AM, said:

Ryan H., on 17 March 2012 - 08:17 AM, said:

My wife is dead, and I'll be with her if I go back and watch ROME again.

Ryan, did you really mean this, or am I deliberately misquoting you?

I did actually scour my post to make sure I hadn't accidentally typed that.

It's funny that your wife is the one insisting on watching Game of Thrones, since the show seems to target libidinous adolescent boys.

I'm only two episodes away from finishing the season, and I admit I resisted it initially. The political intrigue eventually sucked me in, but I still think Martin's brand of fantasy realism shows a willful lack of imagination.

Edited by Nathaniel, 18 March 2012 - 10:42 AM.

[Ryan H.]

Nathaniel, on 18 March 2012 - 10:41 AM, said:

It's funny that your wife is the one insisting on watching Game of Thrones, since the show seems to target libidinous adolescent boys.

She wanted to check it out after hearing so many good things. But she's not at all your stereotypical American female.

Nathaniel, on 18 March 2012 - 10:41 AM, said:

I'm only two episodes away from finishing the season, and I admit I resisted it initially. The political intrigue eventually sucked me in, but I still think Martin's brand of fantasy realism shows a willful lack of imagination.

Do you suggest I continue?

[Jason Panella]

Ryan H., on 18 March 2012 - 04:01 PM, said:

Do you suggest I continue?

I'd say yes, but then again, I'm a fan of the books. (I also think the portion covered in the first season is the least interesting.) It's funny, I'm feeling the same thing for Mad Men after the first couple of episodes that you are for GoT.

[Ryan H.]

Ah, I loved MAD MEN from the get-go. While the start of that show was pretty low-key, nothing about the execution of those first episodes--which are, if nothing else, confident--strikes me as being quite as borderline inept as the first two episodes of GAME OF THRONES have been. Watching GAME OF THRONES, I honestly felt as though I was watching a Sy-Fy series with a bigger budget and more R-rated content, not a prestige show from a network that has staked its reputation on pushing television into more interesting, challenging territory.

FWIW, I did try reading Martin's A GAME OF THRONES, but was kinda bored by the opening pages and hoped the TV show would be more gripping. Alas, so far, it's been even less involving.

Anyway, enough griping. I'll let you guys know if my opinion of the show improves, but I'll stay quiet if it doesn't.

Edited by Ryan H., 18 March 2012 - 05:47 PM.

[Jason Panella]

Ryan H., on 18 March 2012 - 05:11 PM, said:

Ah, I loved MAD MEN from the get-go. While the start of that show was pretty low-key, nothing about the execution of those first episodes--which are, if nothing else, confident--strikes me as being quite as borderline inept as the first two episodes of GAME OF THRONES have been. Watching GAME OF THRONES, I honestly felt as though I was watching a Sy-Fy series with a bigger budget and more R-rated content, not a prestige show from a network that has staked its reputation on pushing television into more interesting, challenging territory.

HBO has a lot of turds out there too, of course.

Quote

FWIW, I did try reading Martin's A GAME OF THRONES, but was kinda bored by the opening pages and hoped the TV show would be more gripping. Alas, so far, it's been even less involving.

Anyway, enough griping. I'll let you guys know if my opinion of the show improves, but I'll stay quiet if it doesn't.

Honestly, the first half of the book seems to putz along for many people. Do you give up that easily for most books? (Serious question.) I have a tendency to wade through stuff I don't like, hoping it'll get better. It doesn't always work, trust me.

That said, I feel like the episodes of the show written by Weiss and Benioff suffer the most. The show didn't really click for me until the fourth episode, which was written by Bryan Cogman.

[Ryan H.]

Jason Panella, on 18 March 2012 - 06:24 PM, said:

Do you give up that easily for most books? (Serious question.)

Not always. It depends on the work in question. But I do have a very large reading pile, and so if I'm not feeling a book, I will sometimes move it to the bottom of the pile with the possibility that one day I'll return to it.

[Nathaniel]

Ryan H., on 18 March 2012 - 04:01 PM, said:

Do you suggest I continue?

Unless you really loathe the show I'd say give it a full season. Some of the character arcs are quite satisfying, and the supernaturalism promised by the opening scene rears its head again at the end.

[Nathan Douglas]

Jason Panella, on 12 March 2012 - 08:10 AM, said:

N.W. Douglas, on 12 March 2012 - 12:58 AM, said:

Question for this season, featuring spoilers for A Sword of Storms, which I'm a bit over halfway finished:

Really interesting stuff. My guess, though, is that they don't do this.

Spoiler

I think they're going to milk Robb's character as much as they can. He's off screen for much of A Clash of Kings (right?), but I think they're going to actually show all of the battles, show him with the Westerlings, and all of the stuff that is just mentioned in passing. My guess is that the Red Wedding will actually be pushed back to the end of season 3 (with some of the, uh, concluding aspects) left as a coda or as a reveal in a later season). I'm being purposefully vague here.

Well, I just finished the book, and I agree with your take. Given how much happens in the second half, it should lend itself very well to a two-season arc. 2014 feels very far away.

As much as I enjoyed it, I hope those seasons aren't nearly as exhausting as SOS was to crunch through. I need a break before starting Feast.

Edited by N.W. Douglas, 20 March 2012 - 01:52 AM.

[Jason Panella]

N.W. Douglas, on 20 March 2012 - 01:52 AM, said:

As much as I enjoyed it, I hope those seasons aren't nearly as exhausting as SOS was to crunch through. I need a break before starting Feast.

Yes, this is smart. Feast gets a bad rap in some circles, sometimes because the pace changes significantly from that of the first three books. (I'm a big fan of Feast, but I think it's a much more meditative novel.)

Anyone here see the season 2 premiere? This thread's been awfully quiet the past few weeks. Anna?

Still, in case you missed it, season 2 debuted to the best ratings the show has seen.

[J.A.A. Purves]

Jason Panella, on 04 April 2012 - 08:28 AM, said:

Anyone here see the season 2 premiere?

I did. They made a nice job of both taking the viewer around to see what everyone is up to and introducing a few of the new important characters.

But, I thought the biggest change from this season to the last one is Richard Madden's "Robb". There's something different about him. I don't know Madden did to his character, if it's just a change in his voice or a look in his eyes - but he's older now. Older, more sure of himself, more in control of himself, determined, and believable as a leader who other men would be willing to fight for. I don't remember Robb like this, not even really at the end of Season One.

[Anna J]

Oh yeah, I watched. I had a premiere party at my house.

Lots of setup in the premiere, but that's on par with the books. Kit Harington/Jon Snow continues to be gormless. I can't decide if I like it because he fits my opinion of whiny Jon, or if I don't like it and wish they had gotten a different actor.

Tyrion was boss as usual. I loved the bit between Cersei and Joffrey when she suddenly realized she had created a monster. Also loving Robb, who does seem to be more grown-up. His fierce yet mutually respectful relationship with Catelyn is a delight to watch.

I haven't read Clash of Kings for years, so I can't offer any thoughts on show/book divergences.

Can't wait for Brienne

[Jason Panella]

Whoa, still getting used to the new format.

A friend has HBO and a DVD recorder, so I've caught the first two episodes of the new season. I'm incredibly impressed at the casting Davos especially), and I'm really happy I got a few minutes worth of Hot Pie and Lommy Greenhands in the second episode.

On the downside, the Theon-scenes-means-lots-of-sex thing has gotten really annoying.

[BethR]

Have we mentioned that the show has been renewed for season 3? According to the linked article from The Hollywood Reporter, the HBO powers-that-be are feeling quite optimistic:

Quote

HBO [c]o-president Richard Plepler said at last summer's Television Critics Association press tour that the network would produce the series as long as Martin wanted it to.

And then, this past Saturday Night Live, we got a "behind the scenes" style skit explaining the excessive sex & nudity. (NSFW) Yes, that would explain it.

[Jason Panella]

Caught the third episode, and will watch the fourth tonight. Brienne! Amory Lorch! Harrenhal! Roose!

Edited by Jason Panella, 24 April 2012 - 01:30 PM.

[J.A.A. Purves]

Well, the season is half over. A few thoughts:

Last episode, like each episode so far, was full of so many good conversations:
- the one between a determined Catelyn and a grieving Brienne who, you hope, suddenly realizes that Catelyn is giving her something that Renly never did
- another, of a series of endless, power struggle conversations between Tyrion and Cersei which Tyrion wins again handily and begins to make us wonder how stupid Cersei really is. She's really clever about hurting people and ... well, is that it?
- Arya latest conversation with the Lannister patriarch was my favorite conversation of the episode. He seems to be the guy where, ironically enough, Tyrion inherits his intelligence from, and he draws facts and insights from Arya that no one else has. And yet, she meets his gaze unflinching, looks him in the eye and lies, and shows something about herself far more interesting than all the other generals sitting in the room.
- The conversation between Daenerys and Ser Jorah reveals something more about their relationship, to her if not to the show's audience. I don't know if the revelation is that he's "in love with" her or that he simply "loves" her, but he treats her like you'd imagine Sir Walter Raleigh or Sir Francis Drake treating Queen Elizabeth.

Thinking about Season Two as a whole:
- so Stannis is the religious fundamentalist character of the show then? His "beliefs" sound like they might be more convenient than anything else, as per his last conversation with Ser Davos, but he is at least being used by the show's equivalent of a "religious right" perhaps? If you are going to have a show about power & politics, historically the religious fundamentalists usually end up getting involved somehow.
- Now that we've seen some of these characters grow, they have much more to work with. Every little talk has ten different other things going on in the unspoken background, and the acting is showing it.
- Jaqen H’ghar needs to be given at least as big a role as Bronn. Between the two of them, I think they could sustain whole entire seasons in the future.
- All the talk about the show losing steam after doing away with it's most popular character from Season One? Not happening. Each episode is proceeding at a nearly breathless place. There are so many characters whose stories you are interested in, and each episode gives each character really so little time, that it's almost unbelievable that Season Two is already halfway finished.
- The pace is so fast (all with intricately woven plotlines, great script writing, sometimes perfect editing, fantastic acting), in fact, that my one reservation with the show is by the time an episode ends, I'm still not quite sure how much depth is really there. It's playing out like a Medieval history, but is there a message or a point? Does it matter if there is one? We do have some genuinely good characters going up against some incredibly evil characters. The story good vs. evil may be all they really need. And since they are telling the story so well, this show, in my opinion, deserves every bit of praise that it's getting.

[Jason Panella]

Persiflage, on 01 May 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

- so Stannis is the religious fundamentalist character of the show then? His "beliefs" sound like they might be more convenient than anything else, as per his last conversation with Ser Davos, but he is at least being used by the show's equivalent of a "religious right" perhaps? If you are going to have a show about power & politics, historically the religious fundamentalists usually end up getting involved somehow.

I don't know about this. It's easy to make this parallel, but Stannis (in both the novels and shows) hints that might not truly buy Melissandre's beliefs. He's in it because he believes he should rightfully be in the throne, and if this red priestess can help him, then he says the words and goes along with it.

As for the show being about good vs. evil, that's something else I don't necessarily buy. There are elements, yes, but the story (as a whole) is more about the shades of gray in between.