47 replies to this topic

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 11 July 2011 - 10:00 AM, said:

I just watched the first episode. I didn't feel lost, really, but I wonder how much I missed--I haven't watched Torchwood at all before, and only a couple Dr. Who episodes (I understand the two series are connected, but I don't know how). Do I need to catch up on them?

Also, has Mekhi Phifer always looked like Tracy Morgan?

Captain Jack was introduced in Doctor Who in "The Empty Child"/"The Doctor Dances" and was a regular companion for several episodes before being put on a busstation at the end of the Eccleston run. He shows up a couple of times after that. He's got quite a bit of backstory to him, but he also functions pretty well without it (although, really, you should probably check out Children of Earth in order to see why Gwen's on the run and Jack's been in space for several years).

I wound up suffering through the first series of Torchwood and skipping the second; if you watch any of it, just to get an idea what TW is (although it's explained pretty well in Miracle Day) you could check out the first episode of series one.

[Tyler]

Am I supposed to know what Spinny Triangle means already?

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 30 July 2011 - 12:50 PM, said:

Am I supposed to know what Spinny Triangle means already?

Unless it shows up somewhere in the second season--and I'm pretty sure it doesn't-- I think the Triangle is meant to be still shadowy at this point.

EDIT: Managed to catch up now. It's sure sounding like the spinny triangle is supposed to be a known adversary, but they're not ringing any bells.

Nice to see them bringing out some of the more macabre possibilities in the set-up, and Oswald Danes as a kind of dark messiah is, if a little sudden, at least sufficiently unsettling to give his scenes a nice sense of menace.

Also--if Phicorp turns out to be the Big Bad, and their plot is just some re-warmed Lex Luthor landgrab scheme I will not be happy. At all.

Edited by NBooth, 01 August 2011 - 01:50 PM.

[Tyler]

I watched the beginning of the Torchwood series this weekend, and I'm wondering if the resurrection hand from the premiere might be connected to the Miracle Day.

Re: The triangle:

Here's one theory:


That is, Triangle + Phicorp logo = The Deathly Hallows

[edit] I looked through a few Torchwood forums, and no one seems to know what the triangle is. One theory is that it's an illuminati symbol.

Edited by Tyler, 01 August 2011 - 03:02 PM.

[Tyler]

I watched the episode, "They Keep Killing Suzie," from the first season, and it reinforces my theory that the resurrection glove is connected to Miracle Day somehow. In the episode, they show it can bring people back permanently (sort of), and after the glove Torchwood had was destroyed, Ianto hinted there might be another one out there.

Edited by Tyler, 12 August 2011 - 01:50 PM.

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 12 August 2011 - 01:49 PM, said:

I watched the episode, "They Keep Killing Suzie," from the first season, and it reinforces my theory that the resurrection glove is connected to Miracle Day somehow. In the episode, they show it can bring people back permanently (sort of), and after the glove Torchwood had was destroyed, Ianto hinted there might be another one out there.

That's an interesting theory. I don't think the origins of the glove were ever addressed, right? So bringing in the other--or whatever made it--wouldn't be out of the question. Of course, it might require more back-knowledge than viewers of Starz!Torchwood are expected to have; OTOH, stuff like Jack's background is already taken for granted, so it could be.

One thing that's bugging me is this: after the events of Children of Earth, you would think someone somewhere would have put the brakes on fascist-leaning governments. But in Miracle Day everyone's chugging along as if nothing happened--and the fascist-leaning governments keep on leaning fascist. If one imagines Miracle Day as a different continuity, it makes sense, but given all the traumatic events that have taken place in the Torchwoodverse (heck, in the Whoniverse, since Torchwood was a major part of at least two Doctor Who finales) it's getting a mite peculiar that the reset button seems to have been set so easily.

I'll blame it on the cracks.

[BethR]

Gave up on Torchwood: Miracle Day. It was not miraculous enough for me to keep paying for the premium channels package when that was the only thing I was watching, or rather, DVR'ing and then finding I didn't particularly care whether I watched it or not. I think Jane Espenson is a fine writer, but I hate this show. Hoping someone would chop Oswald Danes into tiny little pieces didn't seem like sufficient reason to keep watching. RTD comes up with a series in which the happiest foreseeable ending is: everyone dies. The man seriously needs help. <end rant>

[NBooth]

BethR, on 12 August 2011 - 07:54 PM, said:

Gave up on Torchwood: Miracle Day. It was not miraculous enough for me to keep paying for the premium channels package when that was the only thing I was watching, or rather, DVR'ing and then finding I didn't particularly care whether I watched it or not.

I'm sticking with it because I can kind of see a solid five episodes stretched impossibly thin over this run, but I can't say I blame you. There's not been anything remotely as electrifying as the last few episodes of Children of Earth, and even the creepier stuff can't hold a candle to the setup there.

Quote

I think Jane Espenson is a fine writer, but I hate this show. Hoping someone would chop Oswald Danes into tiny little pieces didn't seem like sufficient reason to keep watching. RTD comes up with a series in which the happiest foreseeable ending is: everyone dies. The man seriously needs help. <end rant>

I dunno, that set-up is one of the things that I really dig about the series so far. Perhaps I need help, too. I'm reminded of Zizek's comments in The Pervert's Guide to Cinema that the really terrifying thing is not death but eternal continuance (which I, for one, would distinguish from eternal life, but that distinction depends on a very particular re-definition of life along eschatological/resurrectionist lines). What's interesting here is that at times the characters seem to suggest that what's going on isn't simply continuance but an super-abundance of life, as if the not-dying body is suddenly overflowing with an exuberance that is itself unbearable (interestingly, Jack seems to experience the same thing in discovering that he is mortal). Then again, it's not like we see anyone being particularly exuberant, apart from Jack.

Of course, all that gets lost when you talk about "Category 1" victims--that is, victims in whom life continues but who are somehow unconscious. Then it shifts into an whole other realm and becomes more explicitly political in what seems to amount to a pale re-tread of Children of Earth.

[Tyler]

I just started the second season of Torchwood. Is it worth watching (e.g. better than the first season) or should I just skip to Children of Earth? FWIW, I liked the beginning of the first season, but the second half (except for the finale, which was fun even though it felt rushed) was rather hard to sit through.

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 15 August 2011 - 05:12 PM, said:

I just started the second season of Torchwood. Is it worth watching (e.g. better than the first season) or should I just skip to Children of Earth? FWIW, I liked the beginning of the first season, but the second half (except for the finale, which was fun even though it felt rushed) was rather hard to sit through.

I skipped it, but from what I hear series two is a vast improvement on series one. For whatever that's worth.

[Tyler]

NBooth, on 17 August 2011 - 08:05 AM, said:

Tyler, on 15 August 2011 - 05:12 PM, said:

I just started the second season of Torchwood. Is it worth watching (e.g. better than the first season) or should I just skip to Children of Earth? FWIW, I liked the beginning of the first season, but the second half (except for the finale, which was fun even though it felt rushed) was rather hard to sit through.

I skipped it, but from what I hear series two is a vast improvement on series one. For whatever that's worth.

I wasn't too impressed with the season premiere, even though it had Spike, but the next two episodes have been impressive.

[NBooth]

So, last night's Torchwood ("Immortal Sins") was funny and heartbreaking and intriguing and--absolutely out of step with every single episode that's come before. It's a character episode--a breather from the main plot like that one episode of The Killing where they look for the missing boy. And--like that episode--it was strong enough that I wished the previous couple of episodes had been like that, instead of whatever they were. It wasn't perfect; in particular, the section where Jack is killed over and over and over didn't ring quite true to anyone's character--or even to the scenes surrounding it. Other than that, this episode was good, instead of just having good parts or good ideas or whatever.

OTOH, every clue regarding what's behind "Miracle Day" points in a separate direction--and every single option is incredibly boring. In list form:

Spoiler

• It could be an elaborate plan by Phicorp to control the health industry/make profits off the land sold to construct the camps
  
• It could be an attempt to immortalize the entire human population using Jack's blood--gathered by the three men during the neverending death scene.
  
• It could be aliens who use the overflow of id or jouissance or whatever to power their lives in some way--which has been done before.
  
• It could be a quasi-Masonic conspiracy.

Not one of which, really, has the full creepiness of Children of Earth--indeed, the choices seem a little cookie-cutter to me.

Still, with three episodes to go, I'm in it to the bitter (or better?) end.

EDIT: On another note, as much as I enjoy John Barrowman's performance, the last couple of episodes have convinced me that the real star here is Eve Myles. She's just fantastic.

Edited by NBooth, 20 August 2011 - 09:49 AM.

[Tyler]

For a while, last night's episode felt like one of those hour-long Lost flashbacks where they will in what you've already guessed if you were paying attention, but it did end up pushing the story forward in some interesting ways. Did anyone else notice that when the three guys agreed to the deal about Jack, their secret handshake formed a triangle?

Also, Major Kira!

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 20 August 2011 - 10:16 AM, said:

For a while, last night's episode felt like one of those hour-long Lost flashbacks where they will in what you've already guessed if you were paying attention, but it did end up pushing the story forward in some interesting ways. Did anyone else notice that when the three guys agreed to the deal about Jack, their secret handshake formed a triangle?

I caught that, too. It's looking like Jack is far more central to the plot here than he was in CoE--which is funny, considering how much he's been sidelined in the season so far.

[Tyler]

I watched the episode where Owen dies at the end and my reaction was, "Oh, okay."

[edit] In the next episode, "Dead Man Walking," the "second glove" I speculated about earlier in the thread shows up and is destroyed, after it brings Owen back to sort-of life; he's technically dead, but he can still walk and talk.

Edited by Tyler, 21 August 2011 - 12:18 PM.

[Tyler]

I'm caught up on the whole series now, and as good as the middle episodes of Children of Earth were (I had issues with how smoothly everything seemed to resolve at the end, and how the aftermath of what happened was totally skipped over), my favorite episode of show is "Adrift," from the second season. It's primarily a Jack and Gwen episode, and it gets at some of the more conflicted elements of Jack's character, and what Torchwood does in general. You don't really need to see the episodes before it to know what's going on, either.

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 26 August 2011 - 08:56 AM, said:

I'm caught up on the whole series now, and as good as the middle episodes of Children of Earth were (I had issues with how smoothly everything seemed to resolve at the end, and how the aftermath of what happened was totally skipped over), my favorite episode of show is "Adrift," from the second season. It's primarily a Jack and Gwen episode, and it gets at some of the more conflicted elements of Jack's character, and what Torchwood does in general. You don't really need to see the episodes before it to know what's going on, either.

I must check this episode out. Certainly, I think the best episode of Miracle Day was last week's, for the same reasons: Jack's more conflicted side comes to the fore, and his relationship with Gwen is central.

[Tyler]

Just watched last night's Miracle Day episode. The Oswald parts felt like a bad Blue Velvet parody. I'm glad they're finally moving toward some kind of a resolution for the season, but at this point, I don't have high hopes it will be satisfying.

Also, Q was better when he was on Breaking Bad.

Also also, I really wanted the TARDIS to be hidden under the floor.

[NBooth]

Tyler, on 27 August 2011 - 11:01 PM, said:

Just watched last night's Miracle Day episode. The Oswald parts felt like a bad Blue Velvet parody. I'm glad they're finally moving toward some kind of a resolution for the season, but at this point, I don't have high hopes it will be satisfying.

Alas. There was a time when I was hopeful that Jilly would turn out to be, in fact, the devil (or whatever equivalent there is for that in the Torchwood world), and all her maneuvering around Oswald part of a diabolical plan. That hope being taken from me, I'm sitting back and watching the Oswald storyline fall apart piece by piece (kind of like this season).

Last week was terrific; this week felt like it was limping along. Even poor Angelo didn't get the payoff he deserved. And when that guy we've not seen for several episodes blew himself up because the Family had his family all I could think was how much more powerfully portrayed the morally compromised bureaucrats in Children of Earth were.

[Tyler]

NBooth, on 28 August 2011 - 08:36 PM, said:

And when that guy we've not seen for several episodes blew himself up because the Family had his family all I could think was how much more powerfully portrayed the morally compromised bureaucrats in Children of Earth were.

Do you mean Newman? I wasn't quite clear on why that happened. But now that you mention it, I do remember him being in league with the triangle brigade a ways back. Wow, that feels like it was a really long time ago.