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Greg Wolfe

Top 100 2010: General Discussion--**Poll re-opened**

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The final 'r' was left off Au Hasard Balthasar.

Now you're just being picky... :P

As long as the final list presentation is right. Actually, this is a good point. Will we have the time/do we have the capability to post the final list as a test before public viewing? All our eyes on it will likely cut down on any typos like the ones found here before we go public.

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I only found out this afternoon about the survey requiring you to vote for EVERY film. It cause ME nightmares.

I was told that this function was going to be turned off.

But I guess we're trying to do a lot in a very short amount of time with an untested system, so I apologize for the hassle.

Anna or I will let you know on Tuesday whether we've been able to change the software so that you do NOT have to cast a vote for every single film.

Thanks for your patience.

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You are now able to skip questions. That function was turned off originally, but when I edited the questions it reverted back to "must answer."

I fixed it and we should have no problem in the future.

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Shoot! I forgot to nominate Pleasantville.

Thank God! Persona forgot to nominate Pleasantville!

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VOTED!

Whew. What a marathon.

The scale of 1 - 5 grew challenging for me, because there are masterpieces and then there are MASTERPIECES. I gave a lot of 5s to films that, compared with one another, represent quite a range of artistic achievement. I'd almost prefer to go to 1- 10 next time.

A few regrets...

Did I miss the discussion on whether or not to list the Three Colors trilogy as one item? Yikes. They are three very, very different films. I would much rather list them separately.

And I guess I missed that we were listing the Lord of the Rings Trilogy and the Star Wars trilogy as one thing. They are very different, from film to film, as well. I would have rated the individual titles quite differently.

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Shoot! I forgot to nominate Pleasantville.

Thank God! Persona forgot to nominate Pleasantville!

I am known for my 180s, yet you jest. You think this is outside the possibility of my flippageness?

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Shoot! I forgot to nominate Pleasantville.

Thank God! Persona forgot to nominate Pleasantville!

I am known for my 180s, yet you jest. You think this is outside the possibility of my flippageness?

Persona IS Pleasantville!! Change you name dude!

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The scale of 1 - 5 grew challenging for me, because there are masterpieces and then there are MASTERPIECES.

Yeah, I had to go back and revise several times. A few films turned out to be like that slider they used to have on Hi-Fi systems that you could raise and lower, and it would then raise and lower sound settings across the spectrum in gradations from a center point. Never quite understood what was going on with that slider, but there you go.

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Overstreet wrote

: I'd almost prefer to go to 1- 10 next time.

Oh, dear Lord, no. I'm already cringing at the thought of assigning numerical values to all of these films. I'd much rather just vote on which 100 I like the best and leave it at that.

: Did I miss the discussion on whether or not to list the Three Colors trilogy as one item?

I can't recall whether we had such a discussion. I imagine this trilogy was simply "grandfathered" into the list of nominees, same as with the Lord of the Rings, Star Wars and Apu trilogies (and perhaps any others that might be on the list).

Which reminds me, I've seen the first film in the Apu trilogy -- it's one of those movies I saw in university 20 years ago and haven't seen again since -- but not the others. So I haven't got a clue how to vote on that line item.

Edited by Peter T Chattaway

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Just finished and got a "Thank you for your time!" message after submitting my answers. So I guess I didn't skip a title along the way, and everything was OK with my vote?

I didn't agonize. The 5-star system felt right to me. Several very good films on the list don't strike as particularly spiritual, so those got "1"s from me -- sorry to all who have different criteria.

What surprised me most was that I in no way felt compelled to give "5"s to all the Bergmans, or to all the Tarkovskys. Only a select few, collectively, from among their entries got the top rating.

And, a confession: I took a certain satisfaction in giving "1"s to films that are beloved on this board, knowing that my high post count was weighing down those films in the balloting, or at least canceling out the votes of others. BWAH-HAH-HAHHHHH!!! ;) (I should add that I think the films deserved "1"s, and that I wasn't deliberately trying to sabotage the votes of others.)

I also saw a few titles that only I've submitted over the years, and which I know will get high votes from only me. For those titles, it's an honor just to have been nominated, right?

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I think trilogies are going to have to be one item this time around.

I agree that we should discuss this -- and perhaps change the policy -- but we're just going to need to save that for the next time.

: Did I miss the discussion on whether or not to list the Three Colors trilogy as one item?

I can't recall whether we had such a discussion. I imagine this trilogy was simply "grandfathered" into the list of nominees, same as with the Lord of the Rings, Star Wars and Apu trilogies (and perhaps any others that might be on the list).

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Did I miss the discussion on whether or not to list the Three Colors trilogy as one item? Yikes. They are three very, very different films. I would much rather list them separately.

And I guess I missed that we were listing the Lord of the Rings Trilogy and the Star Wars trilogy as one thing. They are very different, from film to film, as well. I would have rated the individual titles quite differently.

I, too, didn't care for the listing of trilogies as a single entity.

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Voted. Regarding trilogies - I actually would have given The Matrix a higher score had the 2nd two films been lumped with it, but I think I agree that they ought to be separate entries next time. I also can't believe The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe wasn't nominated. Oh... And no Hal Hartly films. Next time I really need to go through the nominees list more.

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Yep. Couple of other nominees missed: A Nun's Story, with Audrey Hepburn. Kurosawa's Ran. Oh well.

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Ryan H. wrote:

: I, too, didn't care for the listing of trilogies as a single entity.

I dunno. The Lord of the Rings and Three Colours were both pretty much shot all in one go, yes? Each film is just a chapter in a longer story -- especially in the case of The Lord of the Rings. (Three Colours is nowhere near as linear as the Tolkien adaptation.)

If we split the trilogies into separate films, thereby allowing each trilogy to bump more non-trilogy movies off the list, I guess we're going to have to split Dekalog into ten separate entries, too. (Hmmm, ten one-hour TV episodes are actually longer, cumulatively speaking, than three two- or three-hour movies, aren't they?) But does anybody really want to do that?

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Well, I have mixed feelings about The Dekalog being on the list at all.

It was made for television. In one-hour episodes (mostly).

If we're including The Dekalog as a series, why not The Wire? Or BSG?

I also can't believe The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe wasn't nominated.

:blink:

Really?

I'm treating this as a Top 100 Films list. Top 100. Of all time. Works of high art.

I don't even think Wardrobe is particularly notable as commercial entertainment.

But then, that's just me.

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Overstreet wrote:

: Well, I have mixed feelings about The Dekalog being on the list at all.

: It was made for television. In one-hour episodes (mostly).

Very true -- though two of those episodes WERE spun off into feature-length films (for theatrical distribution, I believe?).

The thing is, the line between film and TV is particularly blurry in Europe, where you often get four- or six-hour versions of films made for TV that are then condensed to two or three hours for theatrical release (abroad if not at home). Think of Das Boot, or Scenes from a Marriage, or Fanny and Alexander, etc. Do we count those as "film", or as "TV", or perhaps as some third category altogether? And then there are the two-hour movies that get made for TV in one territory but are released theatrically in other territories, like Steven Spielberg's Duel.

But with the exception of those two feature-length spin-offs, yeah, Dekalog is basically pure "TV".

: If we're including The Dekalog as a series, why not The Wire? Or BSG?

Presumably because Dekalog (aka The Decalogue; I don't believe it has ever been called The Dekalog) is a mini-series, and was always intended to be a mini-series, and thus has a limited narrative from the get-go, not unlike a feature film. I don't know about The Wire, but the same can certainly NOT be said about Battlestar Galactica.

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I also can't believe The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe wasn't nominated.

:blink:

Really?

I'm treating this as a Top 100 Films list. Top 100. Of all time. Works of high art.

I don't even think Wardrobe is particularly notable as commercial entertainment.

But then, that's just me.

"Works of high art"! My, aren't we fine! You know the list will get some flak for the absence of LWW, because many Christians did find it "notable as commercial entertainment." It's certainly flawed in several ways, but viewers whose taste is not ill-educated also appreciated it.

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I'm treating this as a Top 100 Films list. Top 100. Of all time. Works of high art.

I didn't treat the list the same way. To cite an example I've mentioned earlier, I gave Charles Burnett's Killer of Sheep a "2" rating, if memory serves, but "My Brother's Wedding," which is an inferior piece of filmmaking but strikes me as a more spiritual work, got a "5." (I'm probably the only one to rate it a "5" -- maybe the only one who's seen it!)

So, several excellent "works of art" got low rankings from me. Kurosawa's "High and Low," for instance, got a "1" -- it's been 20 years since I've seen it and maybe I'm forgetting something spiritually signficant about it, but it didn't strike me as spiritual in any sense, although it certainly is well made -- while "Ikiru," which is much more profound, rated much higher.

BTW, Greg, Anna: If I'm not supposed to be divulging certain votes/rankings, please let me know. I'm not trying to bias anyone else. Just sharing my experience.

Edited by Christian

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The Lord of the Rings and Three Colours were both pretty much shot all in one go, yes? Each film is just a chapter in a longer story -- especially in the case of The Lord of the Rings. (Three Colours is nowhere near as linear as the Tolkien adaptation.)

If they're released separately, they're separate films. I'll only consider them a single film if they're meant to be watched back-to-back and have been edited with the whole nine-hour stretch in mind. As it stands, each one has been edited to function as its own episodic form, released separately, and enjoyed separately. They need to be distinguished from one another.

I also can't believe The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe wasn't nominated.

:blink:

Really?

I'm treating this as a Top 100 Films list. Top 100. Of all time. Works of high art.

I don't even think Wardrobe is particularly notable as commercial entertainment.

But then, that's just me.

And me.

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I'm treating this as a Top 100 Films list. Top 100. Of all time. Works of high art.

I also went that way, and reasoned that if these nominations represent the often unique perspective of this community, then I am giving high scores to the best films that were nominated.

It was really nice to scroll through and see that a large majority of the films we nominated aren't your typical Sight and Sound poll films. Depending on how the vote goes, we have an excellent chance of producing a remarkable list.

That assumes, of course, that people like Christian will stop giving low scores to Killer of Sheep.

Edited by MLeary

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That assumes, of course, that people like Christian will stop giving low scores to Killer of Sheep.

I watched Killer of Sheep last year. I didn't get what was supposed to be so outstanding about it.

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